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Thread: 5 year old wanting paci

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    Default 5 year old wanting paci

    I swear it never ends with DD2

    I mentioned last week in a post about her moodiness and inability to sleep. Many of you suggested she was overtired which I am sure is the case but she claims she can't sleep and gives up a super DUPER hard time at bed time which gets everyone all out of sorts. We have tried MANY things - positive reinforcement, negative, the gentle approach, the tough approach, leaving her be, etc. I don't know what else to do.

    Last night she just went crazy. She decided she wanted to sleep with her sis on the top bunk and A) we could not allow that and B) DD1 didn't even want her there. She just sat there and sobbed and refused to move. I was finally able to coax her down and laid in her bed with her. She was crying loudly the entire time, like hysterical, then started saying she wanted a pacifier! I was shocked and confused. I told her that she gave them up a long time ago (when she was 4) and didn't need them, she was a big girl, that I would lay with her and stroke her hair, back, whatever. In desperation told her to suck her pinky or thumb. I felt really sorry for her that she obviously wanted some type of comfort I was not providing.

    She eventually came into the living room and hung out with DH and I and we let her have something to eat. We usually don't but these seemed like extreme times and we bent the rules. DH walked her back to bed and she seemed ok but not tired. It was 10:30! She hung out in her bed with her lantern on for a bit and eventually did go to sleep.

    Today I asked her why she was so upset and why she felt like she needed a paci. She couldn't really answer but said she wants to use one tonight! I kind of thought that was a one time thing. Now I am afraid it will become a whole battle. DD3 still has pacis so she sees them all over. I am not really sure what to do anymore.

    What is the deal here? Is she regressing? Just wanting comfort? She has had trouble sleeping since she gave up the pacis last year. I almost wish I COULD give them back but it's probably not a great idea. Bedtime has just turned into such a nightmare and DH and I are totally at the end of our ropes.

    I know someone mentioned the book "sleepless in America" which I plan to get at the library soon. Anyone have any other ideas here?
    Thing 1 (8), Thing 2 (5), Thing 3 (2)

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    Wish I could help but none of my kids would ever take pacis...even ds now...so I know nothing about weaning kids from them. Would another comfort object help? A new snuggly toy, something super soft or that makes soothing noises? Both my girls have dream lights, a lava lamp (I think we talked about this before), an led Christmas tree, and now a Moon in My Room that they need turned on at night. I swear it is like a party in there! But these are so others, not distractions, so it's ok. I'm sorry bedtime has been such a struggle...that's the worst time of day for you, I'm sure, when you just wanna put your feet up and crash.

    ~ Cassie, mama to Madison (8), Ali (4) & Wesley (new dude!)


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    I would see if she'll take a stuffed animal or toy to bed I would not restore to a pacifier. Maybe try to read a story to see if that helps her.
    *** Lindsay ***



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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzmom View Post
    Wish I could help but none of my kids would ever take pacis...even ds now...so I know nothing about weaning kids from them. Would another comfort object help? A new snuggly toy, something super soft or that makes soothing noises? Both my girls have dream lights, a lava lamp (I think we talked about this before), an led Christmas tree, and now a Moon in My Room that they need turned on at night. I swear it is like a party in there! But these are so others, not distractions, so it's ok. I'm sorry bedtime has been such a struggle...that's the worst time of day for you, I'm sure, when you just wanna put your feet up and crash.
    Haha it sounds like a disco in there lol. They have a nightlight and they each have lanterns. They also have a bunch of light up pillow things and pillow pet lights and stuff so there is a lot of that available. And yes it's the worst possible time and i have no patience for it

    Quote Originally Posted by mom2CodySophia0811 View Post
    I would see if she'll take a stuffed animal or toy to bed I would not restore to a pacifier. Maybe try to read a story to see if that helps her.
    She has a gazillion stuff animals on her bed lol. She has all her special favs with her. Many nights we have to search high and low for a certain one We read at least 1-2 books every night.
    Thing 1 (8), Thing 2 (5), Thing 3 (2)

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    http://www.webmd.com/sleep-disorders...ural-solutions

    Am, that is so hard. Like you, I'd be weighing the detriment of sleep deprivation against the detriment of a paci at 5. Tough call and I wish I had advice. Just throwing it out there but do you think she could be magnesium deficient? I'd stay away from supplements without dr recommendation but some foods (wheat germ, almonds, green leafy veggies) are naturally high. Also, Epsom salt baths allow for magnesium to be absorbed through the skin. At the bottom of this article, it talks about magnesium deficiency in relation to sleep. (Ah, it went to the top of my post!)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bridget View Post
    http://www.webmd.com/sleep-disorders...ural-solutions

    Am, that is so hard. Like you, I'd be weighing the detriment of sleep deprivation against the detriment of a paci at 5. Tough call and I wish I had advice. Just throwing it out there but do you think she could be magnesium deficient? I'd stay away from supplements without dr recommendation but some foods (wheat germ, almonds, green leafy veggies) are naturally high. Also, Epsom salt baths allow for magnesium to be absorbed through the skin. At the bottom of this article, it talks about magnesium deficiency in relation to sleep. (Ah, it went to the top of my post!)
    Thanks for that link! It's ironic I was JUST telling her that maybe if she continues to have trouble sleeping she can try taking a bath right before bed....and I was going to add some epsom and lavender to it! I was planning to add a drop of lavender to her pillow at least

    We eat a lot of salad. I may try to start adding spinach in with the lettuce to get more of that in them. We always have almonds in the house and she loves them. I will encourage her to eat them. She always drinks warm milk before bed.
    Thing 1 (8), Thing 2 (5), Thing 3 (2)

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    Just throwing this out there. I made a batch of magnesium cream a while back, mostly for DH and I. It has shea butter, almond oil, coconut oil, liquid magnesium, and lavendar essential oil. If you'd like, I can send you some.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Suja View Post
    Just throwing this out there. I made a batch of magnesium cream a while back, mostly for DH and I. It has shea butter, almond oil, coconut oil, liquid magnesium, and lavendar essential oil. If you'd like, I can send you some.
    Thanks! The thing I would worry about is that she has super sensitive skin and excema. Lots of times that acts up right before bed too and she become itchy. It does not help this whole situation. I usually try to remember to do her hydrocortizone cream before bed....

    I am HOPING I may have an idea that will help this bedtime issue. She has been obsessed with sleeping on the top bunk with her sister. I told her we can't have 2 up there. I asked DD1 if she was interested in switching beds and she was VERY excited about it. So as of tomorrow DD2 will be on the top. Part of her issue is constant getting out of bed with reasons why she can't sleep. I was thinking perhaps if she were on the top maybe she would be less likely to get out if it's a bit more difficult? Or she will just become even more of a nuisance to her sister I hope I didn't blow it with that idea.... Grasping at straws here.
    Thing 1 (8), Thing 2 (5), Thing 3 (2)

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    Maybe you can remove the ladder after she gets up there

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    Quote Originally Posted by Suja View Post
    Maybe you can remove the ladder after she gets up there
    tempting
    Thing 1 (8), Thing 2 (5), Thing 3 (2)

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    Ha!
    I hope it works. The switch, I mean. Lol

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    I think an epsom salt bath before bed is a great idea. i hope the switch works.

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    The bath with Epsom salts and lavender sounds so lovely...I take one at least twice a week before bed. I hope the bed switch helps!

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    It sounds to me like she is anxious that she can't fall asleep and she constantly gets up because of her anxiety. The paci must have been a stress relief mechanism and she remembers it. While I do not have a fresh idea I would look at the problem from a different perspective: how do I solve/help her with her anxiety vs how do I make her fall asleep.... This is my experience with DS1; I have to look at the underlying cause and deal with that. I have had huge success with sleep, coordination, speech etc by thinking that way; the solution does not come right away but the longer I think I get ideas
    KEVIN (6) & MATTHEW (4)

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    Just by way of example, I have read a lot of research that swimming is fabulous for children with ADHD and dyspraxia but he was mortified from water and would just sit at the steps of the pool. So years ago I told myself "I have to make him want him go into the pool, not swim, that's a long shot" I would go to the community pool during the busiest times when all neighbors are there so he could see the kids swim. He eventually started going more and more and then I offered the life vest and he would start splashing around until he reached the point of wanting to try without it but was deadly afraid of water splashing in his face. My Dh kept telling him "it is OK to have water in your face" I kept thinking "it is ok for us, not for him, what is the cause of his fear and what would solve his fear of water" So after thinking more, it looked like he hated the water to get into his eyes and we only tried goggles that were not so high qulity. I decided to try expensive speedo goggles and got cool ones for both boys. Alas, DS1 started using them and putting his head under water. He is now swimming all the time, in classes 2 a week. Swimming fixes his sleep and a lot of sensory issues. But I have learned to think differently when it comes to him.

    I do not know your DD but you do, if you change your "angle" you might be able to come up with something that works great. And actually the switch might be a great fix. I have anxiety falling asleep at times and changing the bed, room or something new tricks your mind that the old problem is gone!!!
    KEVIN (6) & MATTHEW (4)

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    Thanks Tanya those are good points. I agree that it's anxiety vs regression. I am hoping the switch helps. It's helpful that there is no school this week so it's a great time to try this. I can always switch them back but I will give it until at least through a school week to see how it goes. She did not mention the paci at all last night so hopefully the switch was enough to distract her from that. I have tried to let her know I understand she has trouble falling asleep and that I am trying to help her. We did the drop of lavender oil on her pillow last night. She has also gotten into "drawing about her day" so over the past few days she would sit in bed with her lantern and notebook and draw a picture of what she did that day. I thought it was great since she can't read to relax the way DD1 can. It seemed like a great solution but IDK...didn't work out last night. I think they both got really excited about the bed switch. I am an idiot for bringing it up right before bed!

    Tonight they still may be excited about the new environment so I do not expect miracles. Tomorrow they are staying at my mom's so we get a brief respite

    In regards to the epsom bath...how long before bedtime should it happen? The problem with these things is that she gets anxious for it to work and when it doesn't it makes her feel worse....like there is no hope for her.
    Thing 1 (8), Thing 2 (5), Thing 3 (2)

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    I don't have any amazing advice, but wanted to add that you could try music or something to help soothe if you haven't already. For my 5 yr old, he is an awesome sleeper and we have used a combo of radio/glow light in bed/favorite puppy toy and it works for us. I don't know how you feel about the subject, but I do know a couple moms who have helped their kids with sleep problems by giving small doses of melatonin before bed. I have to agree that I don't think you want to give in and give her the paci though. I hope you find what she needs to comfort her enough to sleep well.
    ~Andrea~


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    I wouldn't necessarily tell her that the bath is to help her sleep. I know with Savana, if I tell her, "this will help you", she expects drastic, immediate results. It's too hard for them to pay attention to subtle changes that lead them to relaxation if they are fixated on the big moment when the magic happens. Hope that makes sense.

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    I agree with Bridget. I am very careful about what and how much I tell Mira. She expects magic and miracles.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sunkiss View Post
    I don't have any amazing advice, but wanted to add that you could try music or something to help soothe if you haven't already. For my 5 yr old, he is an awesome sleeper and we have used a combo of radio/glow light in bed/favorite puppy toy and it works for us. I don't know how you feel about the subject, but I do know a couple moms who have helped their kids with sleep problems by giving small doses of melatonin before bed. I have to agree that I don't think you want to give in and give her the paci though. I hope you find what she needs to comfort her enough to sleep well.
    I have offered music but she said no. I don't think DD1 would like that. It's hard when they share a room! Sadly we have no other option but I hate having them share.


    Yes I guess I should not be saying, "this will help you relax" because it will not go well if/when it doesn't. I kind of thought it would be more of a mind over matter thing like she WOULD relax and feel comforted in the fact that there is something to help her. But I can (and have) seen how it can backfire.
    Thing 1 (8), Thing 2 (5), Thing 3 (2)

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    So last night sucked too. She was up again until 10 at least. She just can't settle down and seems to get bursts of energy. It was almost worse on the top because she was more of a nuisance and I one point said she wanted to switch the beds back! Poor DD1....she puts up with SO much

    They are staying at my mom's tonight where the naturally stay up later so she will probably be fine there. DH reserved that sleepless book at the library so we will see what that says. We are considering going back to a little bit of melatonin. We just can't go on like this....for her first and foremost but for DD1 and DH and I....

    It didn't help that I had her 2 friends over for a play date yesterday and their mom (they are twins) said they go to sleep around 7/7:30!!! I almost burst into tears! I just don't understand why we can't get get them both down earlier. I NEED for them to be and there is no real reason why they shouldn't be. I am home with them all day, DH gets home early, we are a very routine/organized household....we should not have kids up until 10pm! I can see if we were both working outside the home and only got home at 6 and wanted to spend more quality time with the kids or ate dinner late or something. We eat at 5:30 and get more than enough quality time during the day! There is no need for them to be up so late. DD1 too. She is only 7. She should be sleeping by 8:30 the latest imo.
    Thing 1 (8), Thing 2 (5), Thing 3 (2)

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    Do you think that she is just naturally a night owl? I can tell you that if I stay up past 9:30 it is 1000 times more difficult for me to even get ready for bed. I am AWAKE. When does that manifest in children? My mom said that I was always a night owl but I don't know how typical that is.

    All that to say that the later she is up the harder it might be to get her to sleep. I am sorry that you are struggling so much with this. I don't really have any suggestions.
    Jessica (33) and Ryan (33). Madelyn born August 5, 2009; Malachi born December 23, 2010 and Nathaniel born July 19, 2013. Lost a loved baby 02/29/12, 05/14/12 and 07/05/12 all due a serious allergic reaction to fabric softener.
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    Quote Originally Posted by JJorn View Post
    Do you think that she is just naturally a night owl? I can tell you that if I stay up past 9:30 it is 1000 times more difficult for me to even get ready for bed. I am AWAKE. When does that manifest in children? My mom said that I was always a night owl but I don't know how typical that is.

    All that to say that the later she is up the harder it might be to get her to sleep. I am sorry that you are struggling so much with this. I don't really have any suggestions.
    Actually I don't think she is. I think DD1 is more of a kid who would rather stay up late and sleep later in the morning. DD2, when she slept well, would go to sleep quite early. On top of that I think she actually NEEDS a lot of sleep. Like some people can survive on less sleep....I don't think she is one of those people. And take her terrible mood swings and attitude into account and it proves she isn't getting what she needs. But you are right, the later it gets the worse it gets. We start the bedtime process around 7:30/8. I notice if it goes past 8:30 she gets a 2nd wind and then we are in for another hour or so. I just can't get her to BE SLEEPING before 8 which is what I think she needs. It's so frustrating! Especially dealing with this at night and for 2 hours. 2 hours of fighting at bed time is now what I need after a whole day of caring for 3 young kids. I just can't handle it.
    Thing 1 (8), Thing 2 (5), Thing 3 (2)

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    My dd1 is 5 too and recently she's been really acting up, whiny and crying a lot. It could be that they are hitting a huge emotional milestone- those wonder weeks are tough! And/or a growth spurt. I would definitely put a drop of lavender oil and of either tea tree or chamomile oil. But not necessarily on the pillow ( for me it feels g
    too strong)- on a small towel and hang close to bed.
    Massaging her feet before bed time could also help her relax. And if she is staying up late - dim the lights and have her rather read a book or color, no screens.
    Could she also be a little hungry or thirsty? Giving her 1/3 to half a cup of warm milk and a cookie/cracker might do the deed.
    Just throwing some ideas on what works for my dd1.
    Miss T (10.17.2008) Miss A(06.30.2012) Flipper #3 due 06.2014
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    P. S. You might also try and shift her waking up by 15 minutes earlier. Or even half an hour.
    Miss T (10.17.2008) Miss A(06.30.2012) Flipper #3 due 06.2014
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    Can you start bedtime sooner? I agree with Jessica....I'm a night owl but I do get tired often about 8:30 or 9. I cannot go to bed at that time because my DH leaves at 10:30 for work. Once I get that second wind, it's often about midnight for me.

    What time is the last screen time? There is something about the blue light that is in things like LED TV's and iPads that wakes one up.
    could the routines be too elaborate? Maybe too much light in the room? Maybe try some relaxation/meditation....I would think that there are probably some for kids but even the sleep ones for adults are pretty good. I'm thinking something like they walk you through feeling your toes and relaxing them and it moves up through each body part.

    Do they sleep in on the weekends?

    At that age, my bedtime was 8pm...I got 8:30 when I was 13.

    Jennifer, 35, DH 36

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    im caught in a vicious self perpetuating cycle of late bedtime too, and i seem to be unable to fix it! My youngest is 2.5 and is frequently up past 10pm. DH gets home late, we eat late, and i try to start bedtime right after dinner but things always happen. She is often up until 11. I think if i could get her straight from the tub to her bed by 8-9 she would be fine, but she starts spinning out of control right about that time. Its complicated by her sharing a bedroom with her 3 sisters. Some mornings she sleeps late, but lately she's been getting up at 7ish. She also wont settle to take a nap at a decent time, so she ends up falling asleep in the late afternoon, which gives her a second wind for the evening.

    my next oldest is 9 and she's regularly up until midnight, again because she's sharing a room with her teen sisters. they too need more sleep! and all this keeps me up too. But every single day i say everyone is going to bed earlier and everyday i fail

    so i can tell you what you need to do, which is start earlier and keep the routine sshort and simple, and have absolutely no screen time after 4 in the afternoon. But i'm completely unable to do it myself!

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    Our last screen time is around 7pm. I have tried to cut that out and honestly it was WORSE. They would get involved in playing a game which would get out of control. It's not uncommon for kids to be wound up right before bed. I hear it from a lot of people. We also tried to cut desserts out which is also hard but we are getting better at it.

    We have been struggling with her for at least a year but it got a little better for a while and got WAY worse once we moved the clocks ahead....I have wondered if it was just that....that she is automatically an hour off schedule now? IDK. Yes room sharing sucks and isn't helpful. I have almost considered putting the baby in with DD1 and giving DD2 her own room....not sure what that would do. I have DD3 on a decent schedule and she gets up very early which would disrupt DD1. Ugh. I need another room!

    ETA: And yes every.single.day I say "tonight we are doing early bedtimes!" and it just never happens which just opens the wound even further.
    Thing 1 (8), Thing 2 (5), Thing 3 (2)

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    Have you tried or considered something like supernanny? I don't know if the show is still on but bedtime was a very common problem. http://www.supernanny.co.uk/Advice/-...ay-in-Bed.aspx

    She always reminded me of my mom except with an accent so her approaches feel familiar to me.

    Jennifer, 35, DH 36

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cosmosmom View Post
    Have you tried or considered something like supernanny? I don't know if the show is still on but bedtime was a very common problem. http://www.supernanny.co.uk/Advice/-...ay-in-Bed.aspx

    She always reminded me of my mom except with an accent so her approaches feel familiar to me.
    We basically do this and I have tried to get DH on board with not screaming at her to go to bed I have tried to remain calm and not have discussions but she is a very tough cookie. We do EVERYTHING before bed - food, water, stuffed animal search, potty, etc. We make sure all her possible needs are met. We have recently started a new reward/chore system where they need to earn their ice cream truck money for the week so they can stop it on the weekends. They get dimes for chores they do around the house. With DD2 we give her 3 dimes to start bedtime. Each time she comes out of her room she has to hand in a dime. If she comes out once she will have 2 left to add to her ice cream jar. Come out 3 and she will have none. Do not come out and she will have 3. If she goes through her 3 other privileges start getting taken away. We like this system but there is still too much yelling and discussion involved. Perhaps that is the mistake we are making. And yes I realize we are paying her to stay in bed which I will glad do

    ETA: Also there are no electronics/blue LED lights in their room. They have no TV in the bedroom and their kindles stay in the living room. The just have a night light and their own personal lanterns for reading/drawing in bed.
    Last edited by macksmom; 04-17-2014 at 09:41 AM.
    Thing 1 (8), Thing 2 (5), Thing 3 (2)

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