Secular Confessions

[Ky'sMom]

Thanks for your DBFs mosquito eradication campaign techniques Bridgett! I am going to try to implement some of them this summer. I was considering getting a similar machine that attracts mosquitoes and traps them, but I know someone who got one and they only lasted one summer down here. She swears she caught more than a million mosquitoes and said it was the grossest thing she ever saw when they opened the thing up. The one I saw cost about $400 and if it worked for at least 4-5 years it would be money well spent IMO. I am rather cheap with money on a lot of things but I don't mind paying for good products that do what they say 100% of the time.

I think I will try the fan trick though, I have never heard about that one. Last year someone told us bout BBQ smoke and smoking them out and that does work but we already have bad air quality here and I don't want to have a bunch of smoke around the house all the time and would feel bad about causing more climate change with all the smoke. Plus I like to save a good BBQ for actual BBQ grilling and not wasting coals and fluid.

We already have a ton of birds. I think they are outnumbered LOL! Birds here are actually the main victims of West Nile, that is how they track the outbreak, by how many dead birds test positive for it.

Soren does sound like a smarty Lydia. I always wonder if these "techniques" really work with kids when it comes to language or if it is just in their nature. Elle watched the Your Baby Can Read videos because DH insisted that we get it for her. I found it for $50 on Amazon so went ahead and got it since there are 5 videos and so I felt $10 per video wasn't that bad. She loved the videos and they have a lot of songs in them that she likes to sing. She also spoke much sooner than Ky, like she could talk before she walked very well. Some people IRL have contributed that to the YBCR videos but really I think she is just more vocal and communicative. Even when she was a little baby she was much more interested in observing and listening than "doing" like Ky who was on the go since 4 months getting into everything.

And Myles, I can't believe you were as mean as you say! You seem so nice and well adjusted. I was a warrior against bullies as a kid. Other kids were afraid of me because I would kick their a$$es if they messed with me but I also didn't allow the bullies to pick on other kids and would check them. I got a bad rep for that and didn't have many friends since all kids bully sometimes and my "friends" were not immune from my lecturing and getting in their faces about talking or treating other kids badly, even if I didn't like those kids. I just don't and never have liked to treat or see people treated badly.

When it comes to the kids though I don't worry that much anymore about it. I was similar in that I worried a lot about Ky when he had just started going to a daycare center at 2.5 years old. He was so sweet and innocent to me and I just figured someone would ruin him. I worry more about that sometimes now that he is approaching adolescence because I saw so many of my friends change so much in junior high and high school as they tried to fit in and I worry about that.

I usually let my kids fend for themselves because I want them to figure out how to manuever in this sometimes warped society. I also made Ky aware from an early age that people were always going to pick on him so it was nothing to get too worked up about that and to take refuge in the haven of our home. I admit though that my warrior-ness is something fierce about my kids and at parks I will confront kids and parents who play too rough or who aren't watching their kids. I also will confront daycare workers/teachers about things that my kids tell me, even though most of the time (with Elle especially) I don't think that their tales are completely true. Elle is in a phase right now that when I ask her about her day she proceeds to tell me who pushed, scratched, kicked, stole her baby, and punched her in the eye (this one I was shocked and confronted the teacher about and found out it was true and the provider assured me it wasn't a serious thing but I still was upset she, the provider, didn't tell me about it as soon as it hapened). Almost all the kids in Elle's daycare are the same age as she is between 2 and 3 years old. But Elle loves going there and seeing her "friends" and since I went through similar situations with Ky, I am more calm now about her finding her way through. Ky is very secure in himself right now and I am glad, though some of his classmates do annoy him and he has been picked on, he knows that he can tell us and his teachers and even his principal (we have a very small school) what is going on and it will be addressed in the school immediately.

Erin

[Bridget]

Lydia, the twins sound so mature.

[demigraf]

Thanks for sharing that, chrissy. Hearing a little uncertainty from an experienced mom such as yourself makes me feel less like I'm stumbling around in the dark. I still feel like I should settle on a philosophy of some sort - like, I should join the "let him learn from defending himself" camp or the "be the lioness and protect your cub" camp.

Either way, he's too young to "defend himself" in any real sense. Why can't I just be with him 24 hours a day? Urrrgh!

I see moms wiping the snot off their kids and adjusting their backpacks on the train, and I think "What a privilege."

That story about Connor and the little girl...

[daylilies]

Welcome Lacey!

Myles, I'm glad you asked ;) I'm not ready to shut up about the cruise, but I didn't want to bore you all. This is a long story.

Basically, I was supposed to go and hang out at the cruise mainly with a few girls I'll name M, K and A. I had talked to them all on fb and I met them at a Joe show. They seemed nice and not drama queens. I flew down with M and she seemed fine. I hung out with her in Miami before K an A got there (we were sharing a hotel room the night before the cruise) and she seemed fine then. Once A and K got there (A is the one who brought my passport) they gossiped all day. I started to get a bad feeling.

I hung out with them on Day 1 and part of Day 2 and they were so negative and unhappy. They wanted to scope out the guys, but not in a fun way, in a more stalkerish way. They got upset when they didn't get close enough to get good pics and at the beach concert they were only concerned about their pricey cameras because the guys were squirting water guns at us.

On day 2 I met the girl I told you guys wanted to set aside time for me and we hit it off and her friends were awesome too. I'll call her H. H also knows M, K and A and doesn't care for them at all.

H talked to M and said 'she's been hanging out with us, can she switch photo op groups and be with us?' M kinda rolled her eyes and said Fine. Later on M told me H knew her group was already short (I didn't know, I thought it was full except one or two which isn't hard to fill) and that H screwed her over even more on purpose.

So the Joe picture isn't the issue, I just think it would be salt on the wound if M, K and A knew about it (they are all Joe girls)
Can I just say Karma? I can't help but feel like you get what you give. I don't even try and I get so lucky at new kids events.
Last I knew, things were kind of smoothed over between H and M, K and A, but I don't know exactly what went down, if they're on good terms or just civil.

[missychrissy]

Thanks for sharing that, chrissy. Hearing a little uncertainty from an experienced mom such as yourself makes me feel less like I'm stumbling around in the dark. I still feel like I should settle on a philosophy of some sort - like, I should join the "let him learn from defending himself" camp or the "be the lioness and protect your cub" camp.

Either way, he's too young to "defend himself" in any real sense. Why can't I just be with him 24 hours a day? Urrrgh!

I see moms wiping the snot off their kids and adjusting their backpacks on the train, and I think "What a privilege."

That story about Connor and the little girl...

I think you can just make the best decision you can in each scenario and hope it's the right one. When Bobbie was in Kindergarten she was bullied by one particular boy really bad. She was shoved and hit and had numerous scratches/bruises on her. I wrote, called, visited the school and was told at one point "We can't watch all the children every minute."

I was so angry-I knew if my daughter went to school with bruises on her from home, they'd call CPS and I'd be founded for child neglect at least if I told the worker that BS because it was my responsibility to watch her and keep her safe. I ended up filing a report with CPS and they investigated the school.

I also went along with Rich's advice (Mr. Conservative himself) that encouraged her to fight back. Initially, I didn't but it was getting ridiculous. In the cafeteria one day she'd had enough and hit him on the head with her tray. I finally got my meeting with the brat's mother because she went to the office raging pissed that my daughter dared hit her precious boy.

And you know what? He never bullied her again. It had been going on for 4 months at that point. I'm not sure if I'd do it again because I was a different person then (and listened to Rich's conservative ways more than I do now!) but I admit...it worked. That's why I say sometimes you have to just judge each situation on its own merits. I never would encourage fighting, but I know I did once and it appeared to be successful.

I hope I never have to do it again. Talk about feeling helpless-I felt at that time that I didn't have a choice about sending her to school (didn't know how homeschooling worked). The law forced me to put her in a situation where she was being hurt each and every day and the school's attitude about it was, "What do you want us to do about it?" I still hurt when I remember how bad that was for me as a mother. And I still hate that elementary school...hopefully they're all new administrators because that's where Conner will be going in September.

[demigraf]

...Sorry for the book! Don't be sad for him. It sounds like he's learning a lot. And I'm not of the school of thought of throwing people to the wolves, or sink or swim philosophy, but I do think that if you shelter them too much it is detrimental in the long run.

I completely appreciate the book, Lydia. I want you to know that I listen keenly to all the lessons you share about your children because they are really a pleasure to be around.

I think I would lean the same way as you, and try to model behavior and engage in role-playing with Bodhi to teach him to handle himself in situations. I only wish he were already more verbal, so we could have the kind of conversations you've been having with Claire & Ronin. It's just that he is still so, so young in my eyes. I feel like just not being there for him is "throwing him to the wolves". DH & I did ask him if the kids at school were mean or nice to him, and he said "mean". That's one of the things that made me cry this morning. But DH doesn't think B really knows what "mean", well, means. And if given the choice, Bodhi will say he wants to stay with us 100% of the time. Again, we're not sure if it's the school, or if it's just his age and the fact that all kids would prefer to be with their parents at all times. That's why it's so hard to have him there.

I will say, there is this one teacher - Miss Amelia - who is wonderful with the kids. She's like their personal purple dinosaur. She's charismatic and fun and the kids hang onto her every word. She has a masters in early childhood development and education, and whenever she's around, I find Bodhi crawled up in her lap - once or twice even napping in it. LOL.

So the program is better-than-average, from what I've seen. And I think I've mentioned before that it's city-subsidized. So I have my doubts we'd find a better situation.

I have to confess we haven't turned over every stone yet, looking for the ideal fit. So maybe that's worth the effort.

*******

aaaand in the time it's taken me to write this, I see there's more to respond to, but I have to run off on an errand.

So I'll be back. xoxo to you girls. You are the best listeners.

[daylilies]

The bullying makes me think of when Josh told me his classmate was bending his fingers. I alerted the teacher, but I also armed Josh with the knowledge of how to deal with it when I'm not there. I told him he has to tell the teacher. He told me the teacher doesn't let them talk when they're in line and I said well when there is a time when you are allowed to talk, you go up and tell her. He said "but you already talked to her" and I told him he has to keep telling her, if it's still happening.
They don't let Josh and this boy sit next to each other or stand in line together anymore.

[missychrissy]

Can I just say Karma? I can't help but feel like you get what you give. I don't even try and I get so lucky at new kids events.

I love it when it works out like that.

[missychrissy]

They don't let Josh and this boy sit next to each other or stand in line together anymore.

I'm glad they did something about it, but that reminds me of my biggest pet peeve, especially with preschool/kindergarten kids...telling them not to tattle. I think that exacerbates the bullying that goes on.

I tell my kids to tell, and god help any teacher that says "No tattling" to one of them.

[missychrissy]

And if given the choice, Bodhi will say he wants to stay with us 100% of the time. Again, we're not sure if it's the school, or if it's just his age and the fact that all kids would prefer to be with their parents at all times. That's why it's so hard to have him there.

Conner most definitely was vocal about not wanting to go to school...then at the registration day he had a good time. I'm sure he'd still tell me he didn't want to go to school, but I've decided to stop asking him if he wants to and rather talk about all the fun he's going to have learning new things and making new friends.

Sydney had a daily meltdown going to preschool for her entire year. Once she was there, she was fine. She'd just throw a fit and kick my car and scream every day on the way there. Even after all this time, she says she loved preschool. I don't know what the deal was, but now that she's had some anxiety episodes I wonder if it wasn't that. It most likely was.

[daylilies]

I think they are just supposed to be quiet in line in general. I don't think it's specifically to do with tattling.

[Bridget]

Kate, women can be so odd sometimes. I just don't get that at all. I think it's great that you got a bad feeling from all the gossip. That makes you a good person.

Myles, I would feel the same way as you if that was happening over here and I was worried kids were being mean to mine. I feel really lucky to be able to be around mine as they socialize. My most recent struggle is that Kai is going through this really annoying phase. He farts around other people on purpose and they are really stinky, he doesn't listen when kids tell him to back off when he gets too physical. He's not trying to be mean, he just plays that way. He's also really loud and borderline obnoxious. It's like he's always trying to get a laugh so he tries to hard. I can tell it annoys the other kids and that they sometimes do not want to be around him. I tried talking to him yesterday about it because he gets upset when the kids don't want to play with him. I told him he needs to listen to them when they tell him to stop and that when he doesn't listen, the other kids don't want to play with him.
To which he responded, "Mom. Stop. You are being so digustingly rude by saying that."
I'm going to do my solve everything tactic of a puppet show tomorrow. I make it really humorous but I hope that the kids can see themselves in some of the characters and "get it" without me having to be disgustingly rude about it.

[summerbabies]

I'm glad they did something about it, but that reminds me of my biggest pet peeve, especially with preschool/kindergarten kids...telling them not to tattle. I think that exacerbates the bullying that goes on.

I tell my kids to tell, and god help any teacher that says "No tattling" to one of them.

I'll admit. I'm one of those who doesn't like tattling. I have picture of a matador hanging in my living room and it's within earshot of me at all times,so if it's serious I hear it. We call him Duke and that's who they tattle to. They do know though that if it is about feeling unsafe or someone hurting someone else they need to tell me. The tattles though that are tattles just to tattle. I'll let Duke handle those.

[daylilies]

LOL Bridget, Kai is so funny. I'm sorry he's going through an annoying phase though
Thanks for saying that about not liking the gossip girls...it's just that gossip is so not my speed. (especially when I don't know who they're talking about, ha ha) I wanted to sit around and talk about the new kids and have a good time and laugh, and hopefully run into some of them, and that's exactly what I found with H's friends.

I was the hero of the day one day when we were all sitting in someone's room and I wanted to go back to my room and get my purse. I went out to the elevator and Donnie was there. I dashed back to the room and got the girls and they all got pictures with him. When it was my turn his bodyguard said it was time to go, but I didn't really mind. I got a couple hugs from him at other times.

[missychrissy]

I'll admit. I'm one of those who doesn't like tattling. I have picture of a matador hanging in my living room and it's within earshot of me at all times,so if it's serious I hear it. We call him Duke and that's who they tattle to. They do know though that if it is about feeling unsafe or someone hurting someone else they need to tell me. The tattles though that are tattles just to tattle. I'll let Duke handle those.

That's a good solution. I know there are kids that tattle just to tattle, but my biggest concern was for the kids that really have stuff going on but they're afraid to tell someone (like their teacher) because the teacher is so 'anti-tattle' that they don't dare. I was very shy, and I definitely had problems with that so I got bullied and picked on and kept it to myself.

I'm also aware of some teachers (and even parents) that don't take real bullying seriously at all. "Kids will be kids" and all that.

[Bridget]

I have to vent about one more thing. My kids manners leave a lot to be desired. And I can't help but blame dbf. And he is totally unwilling to see this. When the kids are around him he barks orders at them. "Go brush your teeth. Pick that up. Shut the door". No please, no kindness in the way he's asking, or rather ordering. I know he's trying to be strict but in reality he is modeling really poor manners.
So I'm constantly correcting my children when they bark at me and at other children only to have him consistently act like a spoiled, bossy child, ruining my efforts. It is very frustrating. Last night at dinner we had steaks which is a rare treat around here. So everyone was really enjoying it and I have to remind dbf to slow down because the children eat much slower than him and may want more. So Savana, who likes to eat off the bone, was gnawing on her piece (like that imagery?) when dbg said, "Give me a bite Savana." She said "No Dad." and he told her she was being selfish. I tried to stay quiet but after the third time of him saying, "Gimme a bite.", I said, "You should try asking nicely. Or you should back off and let her enjoy her meal and then if there is any left you can have it." He responds, "I did ask nicely and that didn't work. I want a bite now because by the time she decides that she is finished it will be cold and I won't eat it cold and then it will be wasted."
So Savana said, "Yes Daddy, you are being selfish". He looks at me , and says, "She calls me that because of you correcting my behavior just now." I'm like, "She calls you that because you called her that."
He gets up and stats ranting about how he wanted a bite and he is still hungry and "they" should learn to share and she will never finish and then it will be wasted.
OMG I was just wishing I had a magic wand to zap him away for the night. I told him he should be ashamed of his behavior and he acts just the way the children act that I am forever trying to correct.

He left the kitchen then and was overly nice the rest of the night which is just annoying. I wish he'd just apologize. It would really do the children well if he'd own up to his mistakes.
Ah, sorry so long. It's been a long week.

[summerbabies]

That's a good solution. I know there are kids that tattle just to tattle, but my biggest concern was for the kids that really have stuff going on but they're afraid to tell someone (like their teacher) because the teacher is so 'anti-tattle' that they don't dare. I was very shy, and I definitely had problems with that so I got bullied and picked on and kept it to myself.

I'm also aware of some teachers (and even parents) that don't take real bullying seriously at all. "Kids will be kids" and all that.

Yes, my daughter had a teacher like that last year. The teacher had a reward system where frogs moved leap pads for any infraction and if at the end of the week the frog hadn't moved they got a prize. The kid sitting next to my daughter kept bullying her but she wouldn't tell the teacher because she was afraid of getting her frog moved for tattling. I did email the teacher about it.I think with kids that young the teacher's really need ti emphasize when it's important to tell, and let them know, when in doubt tell anyway.

[3andMe]

Bridget, your dbf just gave me a headache. That is very selfish and immature. I have to admit, I am not fond of people who spend so much time navel-gazing that they lose all sense of perspective and work so much on themselves that they don't see the world around them, but he could stand to spend a little time reflecting on who he is and how he acts. My dh is not perfect, but I am glad that I can talk to him (usually not right in the moment) and let him know how his behavior may be affecting the kids.

Lacey, what an example! That would infuriate me! I imagine parenting is going to get more difficult as time goes on, and I realize tattling is not a great character trait, but I hate to think that kids are going to be cowed into staying quiet if injustice is being done. I think what adults really want kids to do is learn to handle it themselves, thus the 'no tattling' mentality, but if they try and fail, or if the bully won't back down, or if they just don't have the skills, then they should be able to tell the teacher. Also, it's difficult to learn, which things are minor and aren't worth telling, and which things are more important.

[daylilies]

I think there's a difference between tattling for little things like "Johnny is kicking my seat again!" and going to an authority for something like teasing or physical bullying. I absolutely think a child should feel safe going to a teacher for help if they're being bullied and the bully doesn't listen when they say stop.

[The10Eels]

I'm here. I'm just trying to read a few pages back and get caught up. Chrissy, that is so terrible about the bullying. I'm so glad your daughters were there to help her though.

WELCOME!!

Yay for new heathens!

[Cosmosmom]

Yeah to me tattling is minor stuff....like my 11 yr old sister saying to mom about me (age 16)...Mom Jennifer's friends swore. OMG. I adore my sister but I didn't really like her much around age 11! LOL

I'm not one to fight back.....but I will if I HAVE to. I did once in junior high with this stupid boy who kept messing with me...teasing, screwing around with my notebook since he sat in front of me. I told him to knock it off, he wouldn't. So one day when I went to grab my notebook from him, I "accidently" scratched up his arm pretty good (didn't draw blood or anything like that!). This was french class and he said with a lot of shock, look what you did....I'm going to tell madame. I replied, go ahead, I will say it was an accident and who do you think she will believe, me or you. That shut him up because we both knew that madame loved him and he was always getting in trouble. It's been something like 18 years now and the memory is still so clear for me.....I guess I'm pretty proud of standing up for myself!

But on the other hand, kids do fight and will not always be nice to each other. But an hour later be best friends again. I didn't start school until pre-K so I was five. My mom was a stay at home until I was about 7. But I played a lot with other girls...there were four of us all within a year of each other on my block. Two of them....and me, generally not a great combination. Any of us alone with one other was great.....but the three of us, well eventually we all had to go home for the day. But the next day everything would be fine again.

Really being very mean and hurting each other and bullying...that would be a problem. Normal kid stuff of being friends/not being friends/being friends again....not so much a problem.

I know we don't plan on doing daycare at first mostly to save money and we work different shifts. But I'm thinking that if we can afford it, I would like future baby to go to daycare, at least part time as a toddler on. I think that the social skills and learning are very beneficial and I will probably end up being a bad enough helicopter mom as it is.

[Ky'sMom]

That also gave me a headache Bridget. It reminds me of DH to an extent. Some of your descriptions of your DBF makes me think they were sepearted at birth LOL.

Luckily DH is not as childish as he used to be. I do have to remind him though to ask Elle for things nicely. She is just used to me asking her for things and she really does like to share but if someone tries to take her stuff she will let her mean side show to the extreme. DH is always just grabbing things off of our plates, mine too, which is why I don't like to eat with him. Elle screams bloody murder when he does this, then he tries to get upset at her for screaming and being mad at him. So I do remind him that he is the adult and he should act as such and that if he would ask her, he doesn't even have to say "please" she will give him some. She is just like that. Luckily he usually asks now and he does usually ask nicely when he does ask any of us for anything.

I also am a proponent of tattling. I still tell on people if necessary. I won't take the blame for anyone else's incompetence and will call them out in front of everyone. I'm happy Ky's school is very pro-tattling. Ky recently was teased over the way that he was eating a piece of chicken (he likes to eat the gristle sometimes and it can look pretty nasty). His teacher called me after another kid told on the perpetuator to let me know that Ky looked sad about it and they used that as an opportunity to have a meeting with the whole 3rd grade class about how to treat each other and that at our school we do not tease and if anyone hears anyone bullying another classmate then they should tell Dean (our principal) or another teacher immediately.

Erin

[Bridget]

On the subject of tattling, because it's so common around here, I ask, "Do you feel like you can handle it yourself?" If they say no I step in and offer suggestions. Often they say yes and go handle it though.

[missychrissy]

Bridget, I don't know how you put up with your dbf sometimes. "acting up" (by the dad) at the dinner table is one of my biggest pet peeves. It makes me so angry when Rich does it I often have tears pouring down my face. Then I end up losing my own appetite. Rich has gotten better, but every once in a while he'll start up again. I wish I could wave a magic wand and change some of the most irritating things your dbf does.

I think there's a difference between tattling for little things like "Johnny is kicking my seat again!" and going to an authority for something like teasing or physical bullying. I absolutely think a child should feel safe going to a teacher for help if they're being bullied and the bully doesn't listen when they say stop.

See, I'd think kicking a chair repeatedly could be a form of bullying...or a tool a bully can use during quiet time in class as a way to harass/annoy the victim. His/her attitude would be, "Yeah, I'm kicking your chair. What are you gonna do about it?" I'd expect my kids to ask the child to stop, but if the kid didn't I'd want them to go to the teacher. And I'd expect the teacher to make it stop.

On the subject of tattling, because it's so common around here, I ask, "Do you feel like you can handle it yourself?" If they say no I step in and offer suggestions. Often they say yes and go handle it though.

Awesome, like always. You seem to have an innate sense of how to cope with little kids.

[daylilies]

I mean like unintentionally kicking, like little kids just bouncing around.
Joshua has learned the art of sarcasm We were at a pizza place today and they have a coloring area and a wall to tack up your picture. I said "Do you need help?" and he said "Does it look like I need help?"

Lovely.

[The10Eels]

I sent an adorable picture of the girls to a bunch of people in my phone today, and thought, What the hey, so I sent it to B....

This is the first time since we split that he acknowledged that I sent a pic...

[daylilies]

What did he say?

[The10Eels]

"They r gettin big"

[daylilies]

Hehe.
Do you speak to him at all now?

[The10Eels]

Nope.... That was the first I had heard from him since the girls and I were in Kansas City