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Thread: Secular Confessions

  1. #42751
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    I vote for letting her go. He is her parent, too, and so long as he is trustworthy he should be able to be responsible for her for periods of time. How else will he learn? It will be a bonding experience and a good thing for both of them.
    Me (39) DH (46) & furbabies * m/c 7/08 4/12 11/12

  2. #42752

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    I agree to let her go. I would be scared too. I once sent Savana on a 5 day trip to Canada with dbf. It was the longest 5 days of my life but it was over 3 years ago and she still talks about it sometimes. It was probably good for both of us. But SO hard for me, so I get that.

  3. #42753
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    I agree with the other ladies. It will be hard on you, but it will be good for them and will be good for you in that every time you can do something like this, the next time might be a little easier. You could try to develop some coping strategies ahead of time, just knowing that you'll be worried, like asking for his extra caution and reassurance about one particular thing you're especially concerned about and not just a general brush-off of 'we'll be fine,' and/or a phone call update daily, and things for you to do or think about so you're not spending your time worried or catastrophizing.

    I have to say, I was pretty anxious about sending my twins to Wisconsin with my mom by themselves, and mostly because my mom has a really hard time dealing with car seats--just buckling kids in them and taking them out of them and occasionally dealing with a twisted strap. I also couldn't tell her that her unusual incompetence at dealing with car seats made me excessively leery about it, and there was probably more to it, so I just tried to figure out the best solution that would put my mind at rest about that issue. Once we found a reasonable solution for that, and something interesting for me to do when they were gone, I only let myself think about what they might be doing or how much fun they were having after that. It helped that I talked to my mom once a day and she kept telling me how much fun they were having. This was very exciting for them. When they were little and I was so scared about them dying, I wouldn't even let them go to sleep in the dark or without a heart monitor because I wouldn't be able to tell if they were still pink and breathing. I think that's part of the reason they only napped on me until they were 18 months old, and it was hard on road trips because I had to stop driving if it was dark--I couldn't see if they were still breathing.

    Anyway, every baby step I have done to let them go has made it easier and easier for them and me to do so, and has made them adventurous and excited to go out and see the world, and they love it. It's been good for them to do diverse things with different people around them that they can trust, too, just to know that not everyone makes their food exactly the same way or can predict their responses or knows all of their preferences the same exact way I do. It's helped them be a bit more flexible, when they can.

    And if it's anything like the time that DH and I can ever get quality one-one time with one of our kids, they'll come back closer than ever with a new appreciation and love for each other, some good stories to tell you, and extra appreciation for all that you do as well.


  4. #42754

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    I realized this morning that I never answered the question as to why I stay, in light of what I share here. It's hard for me to communicate exactly why without sounding like I am shallow. But truth be told, if I left I would no longer be able to homeschool and that is probably the most important thing to me right now, is being home with them. In a way that is connected to what I love about him in that he will do whatever it takes to support us and take care of us. I don't expect anyone/everyone to understand but that's ok. Also, he's not so horrible. I wouldn't stay if I was miserable. For example, last night he danced with Sawyer on the deck for about 45 minutes and it was awesome though would have been more awesome if I could have captured it on video and shared it on facebook. Also, I mentioned that I needed somewhere to hang my clothes since our closet is too full and that the downstairs bathroom, where the kids sleep, is creepy and ugly. So all week he has been working on both things in every spare moment he has that he's not working on the computer at a job he does not love so that I can homeschool our children children and take a break from found daycare. Most of the time I really believe that he missed some vital connections as a child that make him totally clueless about some human relationships. I don't think that's an excuse but I do see him trying to be better and as long as he continues to try, no matter how tiny the steps, I can deal. At the end of the day I do love him. The way I see it, we're in deep now with 3 kids and a mortgage. Not to mention the chickens. (hee hee) To end it would be so much hurt all around and to keep doing it ain't so bad on most days.
    Last edited by Bridget; 07-13-2013 at 09:13 AM.

  5. #42755

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    That makes perfect sense, B. I'm glad you shared, and I'm glad you're content (mostly, which is all any of us can really be, right?).

    Just to clarify regarding my angst about letting dh take Noe to the river alone overnight -- I'd be fine with him being here with her alone, or taking her other places, which he's done. It's just that the boat is more dangerous. It's a "have to be totally on guard every moment" type place, and the more eyes, the better. And I've let her go with him on the boat alone before, too. But overnight, my main concern is that he sleeps pretty deeply and wears a cpap mask, so he doesn't always hear what's going on. And she sleeps without her life jacket, so if she woke up early in the morning and left the v-berth, she wouldn't be wearing it, and he might not hear her go. And generally she's pretty good, but she's 3, and she might just decide to go see my parents or their dog (our boat is tied up to theirs this weekend). I think I'll just ask him to lock the v-berth, which we usually don't do.

    I do let her out of my sight - I trust him with most things, even though he's a little less careful than I am. But to be honest, I'm not sure he'd trust me to have her on the boat overnight alone either, especially if I had to take it back to the marina and deal with hauling it out and everything, as he has to do -- that's a lot of responsibility and not a lot of eyes on the little one. It's not that I don't think he takes good care of her. It's just a situation where lots of things could happen. The reason I don't want to go back myself is that it's kind of exhausting looking out for her constantly on the water, and I've already done it a few times this week. It'll be easier when she's a bit older and a better swimmer.

    And yes, of course, I am all for them spending quality time together on their own, and I do understand about letting kids spread their wings. I'm the one who let her 15 year old take a Vietnamese bus by herself to LA last weekend. But sometimes smaller steps are appropriate, is all. I do think I'll let them go -- it just won't be relaxing for me, because although I'll try not to, it's hard not to be aware of the things that can go wrong in this particular situation.

    ETA: Sorry, I just realized I sound a little defensive. I don't mean to, it's just that it seems the consensus was that I am being overprotective, and I realized that I hadn't mentioned some specifics about the situation that might clarify why it makes me nervous.
    Last edited by pepperlru; 07-13-2013 at 10:46 AM.
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  6. #42756
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    Quote Originally Posted by pepperlru View Post
    Bridget, I've camped before with just the girls, but we had friends with us - in separate tents, not close enough to hear us talking, but probably close enough to hear a scream in the middle of the night. I've camped with just dd1 when I was a single mom and those are really great memories. I didn't have any weapons -- I don't even think we have a baseball bat at home. Probably the most lethal thing we own is a rolling pin, and I didn't take that camping. I feel like Chrissy ... not that I wouldn't defend myself or my kids if the situation came up, but if someone comes at me with a gun, then I guess I'll get shot. That's life. Rather that than to participate in what, to me, is a culture of violence. And I have been robbed at gunpoint, so I know what it feels like to have a gun pointed at me and to be on the ground being manhandled and cussed at by a very mean person with a gun while two other guys with guns beat my (male) friends up next to me. And if I'd had a gun, it would not have done me any good at all, and it did not make me want to own one. But that's just me.
    Anyway, I try not to live my life in fear too, despite or maybe because I've always been an anxious person. So yes, I camp and travel with the kids, and we have a great time. And we have mountain lions, and I've never seen one camping but we've seen three within a mile of our house, just near the kids' park and in the track field at the middle school. So I suppose we're more likely to get in trouble with one here than out in the woods. Honestly, the only thing I worry about camping is that a tree will fall on the tent.

    Speaking of living in fear, though, I have a conundrum. And it's silly that I'm saying that I camp with the kids and it's fine and yet I'm anxious about this, but chalk it up to that darn umbilical cord, I guess. We just got back from visiting my folks at the river today and R wants to go back for a couple of days. He suggested that he should go and take Noe, and that I should stay here and get a break. Now, I do need a break, and I don't really want to go back to the river. But the thought of him having Noe alone overnight on a boat freaks me out. He gets offended because he says he's a responsible person, he loves Noe, he takes good care of her. And he does! he really does. So I kind of hate that I feel so anxious about being away from her, but it's just really hard for me. For one thing, I'm with her all the time and I'm used to knowing where she is 24 hours a day. He's not, so I feel like he might not be as vigilant. And, of course, it's true that while he is careful with her, he's not careful like I am. He tends to be a bit more relaxed. So am I being silly? Should I let them go? I just know I won't be able to relax or sleep or enjoy the time to myself under those circumstances, but my other option is to go with them and I'm just tired.
    I can't believe you had that happen! How terrifying!!!

    I totally forgot, I did go camping without a man before. With ShannonG. We rented two cabins side-by-side and not only did we camp alone, but we let the teens (Bobbie, Jesi, Sydney, & Breanna) stay in one while we stayed with Mikey & Conner in another. They were definitely in shouting distance, we had walkie-talkies (and cell phones) and the cabin doors locked. It was 4.5 years ago, so Bobbie being the oldest would have only been 16.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bridget View Post
    I realized this morning that I never answered the question as to why I stay, in light of what I share here. It's hard for me to communicate exactly why without sounding like I am shallow. But truth be told, if I left I would no longer be able to homeschool and that is probably the most important thing to me right now, is being home with them. In a way that is connected to what I love about him in that he will do whatever it takes to support us and take care of us. I don't expect anyone/everyone to understand but that's ok. Also, he's not so horrible. I wouldn't stay if I was miserable. For example, last night he danced with Sawyer on the deck for about 45 minutes and it was awesome though would have been more awesome if I could have captured it on video and shared it on facebook. Also, I mentioned that I needed somewhere to hang my clothes since our closet is too full and that the downstairs bathroom, where the kids sleep, is creepy and ugly. So all week he has been working on both things in every spare moment he has that he's not working on the computer at a job he does not love so that I can homeschool our children children and take a break from found daycare. Most of the time I really believe that he missed some vital connections as a child that make him totally clueless about some human relationships. I don't think that's an excuse but I do see him trying to be better and as long as he continues to try, no matter how tiny the steps, I can deal. At the end of the day I do love him. The way I see it, we're in deep now with 3 kids and a mortgage. Not to mention the chickens. (hee hee) To end it would be so much hurt all around and to keep doing it ain't so bad on most days.
    It makes perfect sense Bridget. And honestly, I don't think there is a perfect relationship out there. If most of us were as open as you are about some things, I bet many would wonder "how does she put up with that?" But it's more about finding that balance-how much crap you have versus how much good, and how do you feel about the balance. If the result for you is more positive than negative, then that's all that matters. I admit, I have definitely wondered to myself many times how the heck you put up with him, but I also tell myself there must be good parts about him too because you're not a simpering woman who would stay in an unhealthy relationship. It's still remarkable the things he pulls, but I also admit that unless you're truly upset I've begun to find some of his antics downright hysterical. As in, "I can't believe he said that!" kinda thing.

    Mama to Bobbie 20 ~ Jesi 18 ~ Syd 14 ~ Conner 6
    I'm gonna be a Gramama! Jesi is due 11/22/13


  7. #42757

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    Do you mean hysterical like this?

    I am preparing lunch with the kids and I made a separate, more vegetable laden meal for dbf and I. He is working on the shoreline so I delivered his hot meal with an energy drink on ice. He said, "Can you feed it to me quick? My hands are dirty."

    It is moments like these I cannot speak.

  8. #42758
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bridget View Post
    Do you mean hysterical like this?

    I am preparing lunch with the kids and I made a separate, more vegetable laden meal for dbf and I. He is working on the shoreline so I delivered his hot meal with an energy drink on ice. He said, "Can you feed it to me quick? My hands are dirty."

    It is moments like these I cannot speak.
    Oh lordie!!! lol. Yeah, those moments.

    Mama to Bobbie 20 ~ Jesi 18 ~ Syd 14 ~ Conner 6
    I'm gonna be a Gramama! Jesi is due 11/22/13


  9. #42759
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bridget View Post
    Do you mean hysterical like this?

    I am preparing lunch with the kids and I made a separate, more vegetable laden meal for dbf and I. He is working on the shoreline so I delivered his hot meal with an energy drink on ice. He said, "Can you feed it to me quick? My hands are dirty."

    It is moments like these I cannot speak.
    I think you're right, Bridget, about something not being wired properly in there!

    I DO understand your reasons. I read somewhere that you like people because of who they are, and you love in spite of who they are. I think there is a lot of truth to that. It's definitely true in my relationship.
    Me (39) DH (46) & furbabies * m/c 7/08 4/12 11/12

  10. #42760
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    LOL. Bridget, that is funny....so did you stay there and feed him? Whenever we go through a drive-thru, Rich can't wait to eat, so I usually end up feeding him french fries as he drives.

    We're still enjoying our heatwave. I'm loving having a summer, so we're spending most of our days outdoors while we can without needing jackets.

    Gretchen, I feel ya on the paranoia with mixing boats and kids. We went on a Royal Caribean cruise last year, and I was always freaking out about one of the kids going overboard. Cash especially can climb like a monkey. I'm pretty sure I'll never go on a cruise again.

  11. #42761

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    Ah, no. I said, "Let me run up and get a fan so I can fan you while I feed you." Then I never came back. Hope he's still not waiting.

    I forgot to say that the boat thing would freak me out too and I would at the very least speak to dh more about how he will handle situations where he physically cannot keep an eye on her.

  12. #42762
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    Oh, Bridget, you are so mean. You made him feed himself with dirty hands....bwahaha

  13. #42763

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    I love your response, Bridget.

  14. #42764
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    Today would have been my due date for my most recent mc.
    /self-pity
    Last edited by Gwenn; 07-13-2013 at 11:33 PM.
    Me (39) DH (46) & furbabies * m/c 7/08 4/12 11/12

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  16. #42766

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    Oh, Mandy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gwenn View Post
    I read somewhere that you like people because of who they are, and you love in spite of who they are. I think there is a lot of truth to that. It's definitely true in my relationship.
    I agree with this thing that you read somewhere, Mandy, although it's a fairly new realization to me. One of the few things that still stays with me (despite myself) from my fire-breathing Ayn Rand zealot days was her description of love in her Romantic Manifesto. Something like... you love correctly when the person you love is someone you respect and recognize as a reflection of your highest values. Boy that woman was so black and white, but I did take it to heart and that was essentially the criteria I think I was applying when I ended up marrying Steve. I mean, I think it's easy for me to feel a charge with a lot of different men. I needed something besides a "spark" to know a guy was right for me (especially because sparks had misguided me in the past). To me, DH is all these calm, centered, mindful things I cherish and that yogis strive to become for years. And he's that way just naturally. I feel like I spent years and made tons of mistakes figuring out stuff that DH seems to have known all along. For example, we both came into the relationship saying that you had to be happy with yourself in order to be a happy with another person. But if he'd met me just two years earlier, I'd have been functioning under a completely different MO. So long story short, I do feel I married my romantic ideal in the Ayn Rand sense of the word. But my point is, I do tend to typically not allow for a lot of gray area (and sorry, I know it comes off as judgy a lot of the time), but I feel like lately I've been coming to understand that of course everyone's imperfect, and sometimes outrageously wrongheaded, but nevertheless they can be lovable too.

  18. #42768

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    It must be summer, because I've been camping a few times already, and have many more yet to do, too! Getting ready to go to Yellowstone to camp for a week (what was that you all said about bears????). Then will come back and very shortly after that, do Maiya's birthday camping event.

    And I've taken Maiya camping many times before this year, too. I think, so far, hubby has only been there for one- the one at the farm. Which, other than being in tents, was not real camping at all! He will not be at Yellowstone, but I will be with a lot of my family there, so that is not me alone.

    I've never been worried about anything, really. I mean, I know it can happen, I try to be prepared, but it's never been a big concern. Until I became a mom! Suddenly, I bought a fire escape, multiple fire extinguishers, that Res Q Me key chain to cut seat belts and break open car windows, pepper spray, and am going to be PARANOID about NO FOOD IN TENTS. NO FOOD SMELL IN TENTS. And near the geysers and hot springs? I might just have her on leash!! But it's still not stopping me.

    We went to the zoo the other day, and she was nose to nose with a grizzly bear, luckily with glass between them. I figure, that's enough, we got our bear fix, don't need any in Yellowstone now!!

    And as for guns? I know how to fire one (I'm a pretty good aim at the rifle range), but will NOT have one for self defense. Honestly, I firmly believe that it would make things worse. Have you ever tried to use a gun in REAL (not simulated) self defense? I haven't, but I've heard (from those that have been there, and from cops) that it seriously just makes things worse. First, when you're freaking out and your adrenaline is surging, you can easily mess up. Leave the safety on, have shakey hands and miss completely, drop the gun, things like that. But second, suddenly the intruder sees you as a threat. Whereas before he might have beat and robed you and maybe raped you, now he'll probably just kill you. So yeah, no guns for me for that purpose. I may buy one when I'm filthy rich just because it's fun to take the range, but I won't start sleeping with it under my pillow. It would definitely be locked up and impossible to get to in that type of emergency.

    There was one time I was shooting, not at the range, but at a simulator. That change, shooting a fake gun at what I clearly knew to be a video of a person with a gun, was enough to take my decent aim and make me miss by a mile. I would need a LOT more practice with the simulator (not shooting range) before I would even want a gun in a real situation like that, especially with my kid around. I usually hit the wall in those simulations. In real life, that wall would be Maiya's bedroom. NO.

    Also, in search and rescue, we weren't allowed to be armed. So we all carried those huge D cell maglite flashlights. Great weapon!

    As you can probably tell, I, too, play out scenarios in my head, quite often!

    L, I have the solution for your camping dilemma! (though to be honest, I don't even know what your dilemma is...) Just come to my camping thing instead. : D

    And I also have to agree about where you live being way more dangerous than camping... Where I live is close, too. Sigh...

    Suja, I'm so sorry about your mom... I hope she is ok!

    Gretchen, I am with you on the boat thing. Even before I read your extra details, I instantly thought "no way would I let hubby take Maiya overnight on a boat". Never (at this age, anyway). Not a boat, not over night. My thoughts were exactly what you said in your detailed post. My husband would never wake up if Maiya got up in the night (which she does), and she obviously wouldn't have her life vest on. And alone on a boat? Who knows what a water loving (and non-swimming) 3 year old might get up to... Nope, no way.

    On a boat during the day, sure, and overnight other places, sure. Overnight on a huge cruise ship with no balcony, sure. Pretty much anything except the exact scenario you are describing, sure. But not on what I'm imaging your river boat to be over night. Even with a locked door (unless there is no chance at all that she could unlock it).

    And, how terrifying about being robbed at gunpoint... How awful.

    Mandy... I'm so sorry. So, so sorry. I had a painful STC / loss moment Thursday night. We were planning a group outing, and my playgroup friends don't keep my miscarriage in mind at all times. So when we were talking about the commute, one mentioned to me "Well, we'll just take the carpool, we have enough. Oh, well, I guess YOU can't." It was such a slap in the face. It seriously never crossed her mind. But, for us, it never leaves our minds...

    I'll cry with you. <hugs>

    All right, I've stayed up WAY too late preparing for this darned trip. I think my food is cool enough to throw in the freezer now. I should have been doing more packing instead of catching up, but I am TIRED and miss you guys!

    And you probably won't hear from me again until I get back... And maybe until our exchange student leaves. And maybe until after my group camping trip. We are WAY too busy!! Loving it, of course, but too busy all the same, haha.
    Last edited by Krystal5; 07-14-2013 at 03:01 AM.



  19. #42769
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    Have fun in Yellowstone, Janet. I grew up right by there and went camping and hiking there tons of times. I only saw one bear from a great distance, just a furry brown shape. Moose and bison cause a lot more injuries, so even though they're not traditionally scary and they stand around and munch grass and look interesting, people can die when they go up close to them. One of our family's friends actually had his whole insides rearranged after multiple abdominal surgeries when he stepped off of his back porch with a cup of morning coffee and the next thing he knew he was flat on his back, 50 feet away, and a bison was near his door, apparently just having charged him. And when I took the twins there last time, I did put harnesses on them near the places where they could die if they stepped off the path into a boiling hot pool.

    Mandy, I'm so sorry.

    Gretchen, I thought your parents were going to be there, too, but I can understand being worried about Noe waking up and sneaking out without R. noticing. Can the door be locked or childproofed, or at least he could hang bells on it or something so it makes noise? And I know that you are not a super-clingy Mom, having sent your teenager to Japan (wasn't it Japan?) and on a weekend trip recently without you, but I didn't know what it was specifically that was concerning or if it was specifics on top of vague worries.

    I have been realizing lately that S. is incredibly quiet and sneaky when he gets out of bed in the middle of night, as opposed to every single other minute of the day. He can climb out of the crib and leave the room and close the door without making a sound. And now he can reach the highest lock (yes, we have multiple) on our door, so I've been thinking I need to do something else to secure our house from the inside because I can just see the headline now: "Three year old found wandering in the streets while parents home asleep." In fact, I already bought some hardware I need to install, and it's in the pile of things, like the lawnmower I need to put together, that I need to do something about right away. DH has been coming home after bedtime every night lately, and the few things I used to have him help me with are diminishing to less and less. The one thing I have asked him to do that I can't do--find out from HR at his job if we need to send in a verification--I have been reminding him only once a week for 4 weeks, and every time I ask him he gets upset and tells me he has 50 other things that are more important but it's still listed on his task list.

    Speaking of, I'd better get to work.


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    Oh (((hugs))) Mandy-I wish I could make it better

    Quote Originally Posted by demigraf View Post
    I agree with this thing that you read somewhere, Mandy, although it's a fairly new realization to me. One of the few things that still stays with me (despite myself) from my fire-breathing Ayn Rand zealot days was her description of love in her Romantic Manifesto. Something like... you love correctly when the person you love is someone you respect and recognize as a reflection of your highest values. Boy that woman was so black and white, but I did take it to heart and that was essentially the criteria I think I was applying when I ended up marrying Steve. I mean, I think it's easy for me to feel a charge with a lot of different men. I needed something besides a "spark" to know a guy was right for me (especially because sparks had misguided me in the past). To me, DH is all these calm, centered, mindful things I cherish and that yogis strive to become for years. And he's that way just naturally. I feel like I spent years and made tons of mistakes figuring out stuff that DH seems to have known all along. For example, we both came into the relationship saying that you had to be happy with yourself in order to be a happy with another person. But if he'd met me just two years earlier, I'd have been functioning under a completely different MO. So long story short, I do feel I married my romantic ideal in the Ayn Rand sense of the word. But my point is, I do tend to typically not allow for a lot of gray area (and sorry, I know it comes off as judgy a lot of the time), but I feel like lately I've been coming to understand that of course everyone's imperfect, and sometimes outrageously wrongheaded, but nevertheless they can be lovable too.
    I get what you're saying and I totally agree with you 100%. Marriage/relationships aren't as black and white as we were led to believe they'd be. Or maybe it was just me & reading too many romance novels growing up. At any rate, it's a complex dynamic that really does involve give and take and compromise.

    I've been thinking a lot about this because I'm really, really struggling with my current relationship and whether I want to continue it, and even I know my reasons are stupid. Perhaps I'm too lazy, or perhaps I never really did have a 'real' relationship with Rich so I'm completely unprepared for one now I really don't know. I've been looking back a lot and after our very early years (2? 3?) Rich just seemed to always go along with everything I wanted. I didn't notice at the time, but I didn't have a counterpart to bounce contrary ideas off of. Sometimes that's nice-but other times, I might not have known all there was to know about options and as a result made a poor decision.

    So here I am in a relationship that really, really feels great. He's been an extremely close friend for years and I do love him. There's spark and romance and all of that, but that's not the foundation of our relationship. We don't even have huge problems and the ones that do come up aren't even big. So why do I spend 1/2 the night (or sometimes a couple days in a row) telling myself I don't want to be in a relationship after we have a disagreement?

    I suspect I've been conditioned to hear I'm always right about everything. This is new ground and I am struggling hard with not running away from the whole thing. I can't help but think about how much simpler life would be if my focus were kids and work and nothing else. But the reality is, I'm not sure I want to put any work into a relationship at all.

    Or maybe I'm just burned out after fighting so hard to save my marriage for the last 5-6 years that I really do need a break. Whatever the case may be, I know I'm on the brink of ruining a great relationship. I've holed up in my house and haven't been speaking to John at all. I had a tentative plan to go out there tonight and there's a part of me that doesn't want to, even though I know everything will be fine if I do. I'll feel better after I see him because he always makes me feel better. We'll talk more and resolve the latest disagreement because we always do. Why would I want to run from that? I also know, the more I stay away from him over this, the harder it will be for me to actually see him.

    I'm a complete mess.

    Mama to Bobbie 20 ~ Jesi 18 ~ Syd 14 ~ Conner 6
    I'm gonna be a Gramama! Jesi is due 11/22/13


  21. #42771
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    Whew-talk much Chrissy? I think I made it a bigger deal than it is. Or perhaps it's bugging me more than I realize.

    I'm not oblivious to the fact that it's fairly common for women who finally get out of abusive relationships to repeatedly break off with healthy subsequent ones because they don't feel the 'love' that they felt with their abuser. Maybe there's a parallel I'm unaware of with spouses of alcoholics

    Mama to Bobbie 20 ~ Jesi 18 ~ Syd 14 ~ Conner 6
    I'm gonna be a Gramama! Jesi is due 11/22/13


  22. #42772

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    Mandy, I'm sorry. And Janet, too, and everyone here with tender and mended hearts.

    So I let them go, and dh's been great about sending me texts with pics to keep me updated - when they arrived, after she fell asleep, when she woke up safe this morning. Thank goodness he understands me. Even when I reminded him (again) this morning not to skimp on the sunscreen. Like he would (he wouldn't). And Lydia, India was where my dd went last summer! She was 14 and gone for a month. She was with my mom and my sister, perfectly safe, and I'm so glad she went. She can't wait to go back. But I was scared, not gonna lie. Actually, it was nice that one of the places she was staying was the same city where Suja's parents live. I found it relieving to know that if anything happened, there was a way to find a friendly local face. She ended up having a spectacular time and loves, loves, loves India.
    -- mom to DD1 1/98 and DD2 10/09


  23. #42773
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    It's always terrifying when your kids leave like that. I don't think it gets any easier, even when they're older. Heck, Bobbie is 20 and one of her part time jobs is sports photographer (like for little league games and such). She had a job that was 2-3 hours away and I was a nervous wreck about her driving that far. Plus, it was a city she's not familiar with.

    But I'll also admit, I felt better about even myself being alone in St Louis just knowing newbie (apa mama) was in the area. Just in case 'something' happened there was someone relatively close. It's the mom in us that makes us think that way.

    Mama to Bobbie 20 ~ Jesi 18 ~ Syd 14 ~ Conner 6
    I'm gonna be a Gramama! Jesi is due 11/22/13


  24. #42774

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    Quote Originally Posted by missychrissy View Post
    Whew-talk much Chrissy? I think I made it a bigger deal than it is. Or perhaps it's bugging me more than I realize.

    I'm not oblivious to the fact that it's fairly common for women who finally get out of abusive relationships to repeatedly break off with healthy subsequent ones because they don't feel the 'love' that they felt with their abuser. Maybe there's a parallel I'm unaware of with spouses of alcoholics

    I'm going to quote this one, though I get what you were saying in the previous post all too well. For me, it's that I just want to run away. Constantly. Something goes even kind of wrong, I want to run. Heck, just last night, I tried to have a conversation with DH about how he ignores me a large part of the time and I feel like most of our communication is online even though our desks are 5 feet apart. Granted, I was just FEELING ignored more than I actually am, but still, I felt it. So finally he steps away and comes to sit with me and talk on the couch, 2 minutes later he was asleep... (ETA: I don't leave often at all. Usually I just go lay in my car for a while. But feeling ignored was kind of the last straw for me and the only straw he really had anything to do with. I'm just not happy with my life right now. Just didn't want you to get the wrong idea.)

    So I left. He heard me leave and came with me. But I just drove for close to 3 hours before he convinced me to turn around. I would have come back in the morning, don't get me wrong. I lived in my car for 6 years and so that's where I feel safe.

    Now look who's getting long-winded. haha

    But my point being, living with an alcoholic I have no doubt puts you in an EXTREMELY similar situation as living with an abusive partner for the rest of your relationship-having life. I've been with my DH for over 7 years now, and I STILL don't really understand how to have a "normal" relationship. I believe my parents had a very real-world relationship. So I at least had that growing up. I saw them fight, and love each other, and have real issues. My mother even sat on the couch crying at one point and told my older sister (though I heard, too, and she probably wouldn't have said it had she known I was there as I was only 8) that if it weren't for all us kids she would have left him long ago. At the time I felt awful about it, but by the time I was 15 or so I realized that she was just emotional and probably didn't even really mean it. But she FELT it, and that's all that ever really matters.

    After finally realizing, 100% knowing for sure, that DH was a great guy and I could say whatever I wanted, I talk to him about EVERYTHING. We have great communication. Even if I make it sound like we don't. If either of us has anything going on, we talk. We talk a lot. So most of our disagreements only last a few hours at the most. A lot of the time it's one of us (though I feel like it's usually me) just sucking it up and apologizing to the other for getting defensive. Because that tends to be why a lot of our disagreements are anything more than short 2 second exchanges, we both get defensive really easily. But it is what it is. But after saying sorry, and we both have then had a bit to actually think about what had been said, THEN we have the real conversation.

    So, I guess what I'm saying is, when things are really bugging you more than seems reasonable, say something. Even if it's just writing him an email that's super long winded and you know only half-way makes sense, just do it. I used to do that all the time with my DH to get conversations started, or to just get him to realize what I was feeling. Either way, it helped. And having good communication in any relationship is more important than anything else, I believe.

    Good luck.
    Last edited by EllyD14; 07-14-2013 at 12:38 PM.

  25. #42775
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    Quote Originally Posted by EllyD14 View Post

    So, I guess what I'm saying is, when things are really bugging you more than seems reasonable, say something. Even if it's just writing him an email that's super long winded and you know only half-way makes sense, just do it. I used to do that all the time with my DH to get conversations started, or to just get him to realize what I was feeling. Either way, it helped. And having good communication in any relationship is more important than anything else, I believe.

    Good luck.
    Thank you. For all of it. I do think Rich's alcoholism probably plays into a lot of the struggles I have now.

    Ironically, I have done the long-winded emails but with John that seems to exacerbate the issues. He does a lot better when I tell him in person although that's not foolproof either. He has his own issues outside of me and I'm trying to figure out if there's even a safe way for me to bring up any insecurity or doubt to him (when it relates to him specifically) without his first reaction being defensiveness.

    He always mulls everything over and we seem to work it out, but I don't want the 'battle' every time I have a little issue to address. I know it's something we'll have to talk about if we're going to continue.

    Mama to Bobbie 20 ~ Jesi 18 ~ Syd 14 ~ Conner 6
    I'm gonna be a Gramama! Jesi is due 11/22/13


  26. #42776

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    So cool that Noe got to go and dh is being thoughtful about your concerns. It is comforting when a person understands your worries instead of poo pooing them. And are you getting to relax?

    Chrissy, if I had any one bit of advice it would be to try not to over think everything. In the end, the two of you may part ways but for now just try to enjoy what's good and let the rest work itself out as it will. Seems silly to end it all just to avoid it ending later. BUT I am no expert on relationships.

    Welcome back, Elly ( do we call you Elly?) Nice to see you here.

    How are you today, Mandy?
    Last edited by Bridget; 07-14-2013 at 02:20 PM.

  27. #42777
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    Chrissy, I think it's interesting you said that about Rich. Honestly, when you were talking about your most recent argument with John my private thought was that because Rich basically let you do all the thinking for your relationship, and because you were with him from such a young age, you haven't had to practice/learn the art of negotiation with an adult male. Because it is an art and there is a technique to it. I agree with Bridget - enjoy what is good and let it work itself out. You will both learn what works for each other, and it will get better over time.

    That sounds rather critical, but it's critical of Rich, not you.

    Bridget, thanks for asking. Honestly, I thought I was reasonably okay but I had a really, really dark night last night.

    I just wrote a bunch and erased it. I know you all don't need to hear me feel sorry for myself at length.
    Me (39) DH (46) & furbabies * m/c 7/08 4/12 11/12

  28. #42778

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    Yes we do need to hear it. Especially if you need to say it.

  29. #42779
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bridget View Post
    Yes we do need to hear it. Especially if you need to say it.


    I don't know if I need to say it, or not.

    I just feel like I'm turning 40 and without the chance to raise a family ... what happens? It all seems so empty. Work is work. I really do love my job but I that can't be the only thing in my life.

    I know the appropriate response is that I need to find something new but really, there is nothing out there that will satisfy that place of raising a family. Like taking up a new hobby is going to be a compensation?

    And I see lots of children. It's not like I don't have kids to interact with on a regular basis. Offering to babysit or spending more time with children isn't the answer, either ... because I already do. It isn't the same when they aren't your kids. Even spending time with my niece and nephews ... they are family, but they aren't my kids.
    Me (39) DH (46) & furbabies * m/c 7/08 4/12 11/12

  30. #42780
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    I'm so sorry, Mandy! I wish I could say something that would be helpful to you. Have you mentioned before that your dh isn't interested in adoption? What about fostering?

    And I'm sorry you're suffering as well, Janet. Mc are so very hard to move on from. I had 2 between having the boys.

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