Secular Confessions

[Gwenn]

Mandy, I would like your expert opinion if you don't mind. The woman that evaluated Sawyer was giving me pointer to help him expand his vocab and when I responded to his part blabber/part words by saying, "You want me to put your boots on?", she said that I should say, "I want my boots on?". Say to him what I presume he was saying. I'm having a hard time correcting myself and feeling like that's just confusing his use of pronouns. What say you?

Honestly I agree with both of you. Pronouns are a bit sticky and can be really confusing - but at the same time I do a lot of direct modeling. With my (admittedly language disordered) kids, I will say something like "boots on, please" to model what I want them to say. I'm guessing from what you were saying that Sawyer is really more at the level of 1-2 word utterances so what I like to do is model just slightly above the level of language the child is producing. So "boots on, please" is probably slightly more advanced than what he is doing now, while avoiding the pronoun issue entirely. Once he gets to that point I would raise the bar a little and possibly I might model a full sentence such as "I want my boots on" - but I don't think he is there yet and I think that model is too advanced.

Just my two cents - take it for what it's worth.

And oh - I KNEW there was someone I left out! I'm glad you had the eval done and glad he came out at 22 months. That's pretty close to his actualy age, right?

ETA: In a typically developing child I would expect that progression to happen pretty quickly and once he gets the first part, that second jump will follow not too long after, to "want boots on" then "I want boots on" - you get the picture.

[Bridget]

Yes he will be 2 on Saturday!

[Gwenn]

Already! Wow!

[3andMe]

Amazing! Bridget, this is one of the things that I get annoyed about when I can check APA on the fly when waiting in long lines at grocery stores, or waiting to pick the kids up at school. I LOVED reading that Sawyer got his eval and was on target. That was so cool. And then I completely spaced it because so many things happened by the next time I checked in, but I felt like I'd been staying mostly on top of everything so I didn't feel like I had to go back and read several pages. That happens to me a lot. I like having a smart phone because I don't have to carry a book around with me, and when everyone else was getting annoyed in the grocery line because the lady at the front forgot her bags, I just hung out and relaxed (no fussy kid!!!!) and checked APA, but it does make me lose track of things.

Anyway, yay Sawyer~!

[demigraf]

Happy birthday, Sawyer!!!

We're not Disney people either. As a teen, my parents once took us to this enormous 3-day charismatic prayer conference at the Anaheim convention center, and our days were spent killing time at "The Happiest Place on Earth" with the other kids of my folks' friends who similarly got dragged there, while our nights were spent listening to practically a stadium full of people speaking in tongues. I even skipped "Grad Night" at Disneyland in high school, where most of my graduating class was tripping its brains out on acid/ecstasy nights before graduation. (It was called "candy-flipping" back then). Still, Bodhi is going to love Cars Land, and things that I used to totally poo-poo are made fresh in my eyes again by watching Bodhi enjoy them, so I think I'll manage to enjoy myself when that trip happens.

[Gwenn]

Oh, I love the stories in this thread. Giant charismatic prayer conference? Who knew?

[demigraf]

L, seeing S in that shirt in your siggy is making me nostalgic for baby Bodhi in the same one:

72243_452528474453_613608_n.jpg 41135_428346999453_2819852_n.jpg 75858_461986879453_2778186_n.jpg


Speaking of FB and photos, I can't wait to create my new FB album for Bodhi, age 4. I'm going to call it "Four's To Be Reckoned With". There's a chance I might be more enamored with the album title than any of the photos I'm going to put in it.

[demigraf]

(And hello to the 9 people viewing the Secular forum at the moment. That's actually 5 less than when I first posted tonight. I think I bored them away.)

[Gwenn]

I'm one of them. And so enamored of the cuteness of baby Bodhi pics I had nothing to say!

[Krystal5]

I'm SO bored tonight, and though I have a ton of chores I need to do, feel like flopping on the computer. I've made a couple responses and a post, but every where else is totally dead (even my FB...), and this thread was active, so I came to take a peak! Hope you guys don't mind.

I don't often get evenings like this, where I will sit and just browse APA and look for something to talk about, so I probably won't be very active in here. But, I know a few ladies, and recognize almost everyone, so since Mylah said hi, I thought I would, too.

And, aw, bitty baby Bodhi!! I haven't seen him since he was that tiny... I still appreciate you coming to help me that day.

[demigraf]

Hello, Janet! I feel like I should have helped more somehow. I got there just 45 min before you were leaving for the doctor. How is Maiya doing? She must be a bit bigger than the little peanut I carried around that day.

[demigraf]

Oh, and hi, Mandy!!! We really need to go to sleep. LOL!

[Krystal5]

Hello, Janet! I feel like I should have helped more somehow. I got there just 45 min before you were leaving for the doctor. How is Maiya doing? She must be a bit bigger than the little peanut I carried around that day.

When you have a newborn who won't be put down, when is help more needed than when trying to figure out how to get out of the house on time?? You were a great help!

Let's see... She was in the 2nd percentile when you met her... She's now in the 97th! So, yes, just a WEE bit bigger, heh. Who am I kidding, she's huge... But she's amazing! I'm having so so much fun with her. Running everywhere, talking up a storm (just no one can understand her, hah), learning her letters and the beginnings of reading, making up stories... Trying to get her ready for a trip to Hawaii in June, so excited. Not happy that it's still 6 months away, but at least that gives me plenty of time to try to get her more comfortable around water!

How are you and Bodhi? He must be quite a bit bigger than I remember, too!

[missychrissy]

Amazing! Bridget, this is one of the things that I get annoyed about when I can check APA on the fly when waiting in long lines at grocery stores, or waiting to pick the kids up at school. I LOVED reading that Sawyer got his eval and was on target. That was so cool. And then I completely spaced it because so many things happened by the next time I checked in, but I felt like I'd been staying mostly on top of everything so I didn't feel like I had to go back and read several pages. That happens to me a lot. I like having a smart phone because I don't have to carry a book around with me, and when everyone else was getting annoyed in the grocery line because the lady at the front forgot her bags, I just hung out and relaxed (no fussy kid!!!!) and checked APA, but it does make me lose track of things.

Anyway, yay Sawyer~!

That happens to me as well L. But it's nice to keep up, even if I forget what I intended to say when I first read a post.

I'm SO bored tonight, and though I have a ton of chores I need to do, feel like flopping on the computer. I've made a couple responses and a post, but every where else is totally dead (even my FB...), and this thread was active, so I came to take a peak! Hope you guys don't mind.

I don't often get evenings like this, where I will sit and just browse APA and look for something to talk about, so I probably won't be very active in here. But, I know a few ladies, and recognize almost everyone, so since Mylah said hi, I thought I would, too.

And, aw, bitty baby Bodhi!! I haven't seen him since he was that tiny... I still appreciate you coming to help me that day.

I think I might be looking for reasons to be annoyed by Bobbie. When I got home last night, she was only just starting the dishes she'd promised the previous night to have done. She quickly spoke up and said, "I didn't forget. I just woke up." That was at 5:45 p.m. And despite the fact that I've told her I'm barely making it and 'we' need to be careful about leaving lights on (because I found myself turning her bedroom light off 3 times in 1 day), I woke up at 3:00 a.m. this morning to see she'd left the living room light on and went to bed to read. She was still awake. I did get snippy and I told her I will not be running behind her like she's a child turning off all the lights.

Also, when I told her as soon as she got a job she'd be paying me rent since she could afford to do it for her friend, she looked pissed off about it. I'm paying everything-her car insurance, cell phone, and she's living with me and doesn't think she should have to give me $35/week? I don't get it. She's not inconsiderate. She's very thoughtful and kind and giving. To everyone else except me.

[3andMe]

Mylah, that shirt that S. was wearing was actually handed down from R, who got it from the other Ronin on APA, the son of Jenny. I used to buy a box of clothes in bulk from her about once or twice a year, so a lot of my boy clothes and some girl clothes were from her. She said she always liked seeing my kids in her kids' hand-me-downs. It gave her a bit of nostalgia, kind of like it was giving to you. The shirt S was wearing was a size 4, though, and I just decided it was getting too small for him. He is just over 2 1/2. Admittedly it's a small 4, but he and R are sharing clothes now. They are sharing underwear and shirts, but not pants. DH is having a heck of a time putting clothes away.

Bodhi is adorable in those pictures.

Hey, Janet, welcome to the thread! I just got two new memberships with guest passes (Lindsay Wildlife Museum and California Academy of Sciences) and I know we haven't been able to connect lately, but I would love to do something with you soon.

Usually at night, after 10 PM PST, when I look up who is looking at the thread, it's usually "guest" (unregistered) users, often with IPs in Asia or Australia. I don't know why we're so popular. There is also usually a little cluster looking at other very benign, older threads, like a question in Expecting in General, or an old thread in New Moms.

Chrissy, I imagine Bobbie either knows how to push your buttons or your buttons just get pushed by the same things because they happen so much and you're sick of them. I get tired of saying the same stuff all the time. I look back on my teenage years and wonder why the heck I couldn't just clean the litter box without being told a million times, especially since I'm so responsible now. My poor mom. But I couldn't, or didn't.

[Bridget]

I wasn't nice to my mom either. I couldn't stand her for a good few years. Quite likely the only thing I would change about my past if I could.

[Cosmosmom]

I HAD to be nice to my mom. Mean thoughts of course but had to keep those to myself. But my mom wasn't the type to try to be my friend at that age and she demanded respect. I do think that I was pretty spoiled and my parents would do just about anything for us.....but my mom is also a pretty strong MY way or the highway kind of person. Long as it was her house and her money I had to follow her rules and be respectful (as in no swearing, no rolling eyes with the whatever, no talking back....tried tears but those never worked). I did pull some crap at almost 19 and was given a second chance but knew that there was not going to be a third and fourth chance.

Now I am friends with my mom. And can do dishes when I feel like it and fold towels how I think is the better way. My house, my money, my rules.

[Suja]

It would never have occurred to me to cross my mom. There is great value to that unsaid 'Or else'. I didn't know what would happen, and didn't want to find out either. Considering that mom is like 4'8" and weighed probably 70 lbs., it's a pretty big accomplishment.

Speaking of pushing buttons, Mira has been pushing mine lately. Lots of crying over nothing or small things, throwing things, hitting me/dogs, kicking at the cat, spitting. Time outs are not exactly working (she gets even more worked up, and says all sorts of mean stuff), other than to give me a physical break from her. I'm considering taking away one toy at a time, for every 'incident'. She can earn it back with good behavior. Can't wait for her to turn into a teenager.

[Bridget]

my mom screamed and yelled at me so much that I just couldn't' t wait to get out of the house. She later told me she felt quite sure she struggled with untreated depression. I should have forgiven her sooner but as it was I did not learn to appreciate her until I was a mom myself and little did I know by then we were on borrowed time.

I am about losing my mind with dbf home for two weeks. I would give details but honestly don't know where to start.

[missychrissy]

It would never have occurred to me to cross my mom. There is great value to that unsaid 'Or else'. I didn't know what would happen, and didn't want to find out either. Considering that mom is like 4'8" and weighed probably 70 lbs., it's a pretty big accomplishment.

Speaking of pushing buttons, Mira has been pushing mine lately. Lots of crying over nothing or small things, throwing things, hitting me/dogs, kicking at the cat, spitting. Time outs are not exactly working (she gets even more worked up, and says all sorts of mean stuff), other than to give me a physical break from her. I'm considering taking away one toy at a time, for every 'incident'. She can earn it back with good behavior. Can't wait for her to turn into a teenager.

You'll rue those words!!

my mom screamed and yelled at me so much that I just couldn't' t wait to get out of the house. She later told me she felt quite sure she struggled with untreated depression. I should have forgiven her sooner but as it was I did not learn to appreciate her until I was a mom myself and little did I know by then we were on borrowed time.

I am about losing my mind with dbf home for two weeks. I would give details but honestly don't know where to start.

That makes me so sad for you. Well, both.

Bobbie wasn't like this at all until a few months after she was attacked. Intellectually, I get it. She has a lot of anger and I'm a 'safe' place for her to unleash some of it. She is in therapy, but still, I think there's an element of her hanging on to being a victim. I know I can't say how I'd be or what the magic trick is, but I've read enough and seen enough interviews of other women that survived similar attacks and they all said that they got to a point where they decided to be a survivor, rather than a victim. I wish I knew how to help get her there. Her life just completely fell 100% apart after that.

I'm not letting her use that as a manipulative tool though. She's not going to take advantage of me like she did the last time. Like I said, I'm probably just looking for things to get annoyed about at this stage because I'm dreading a repeat of how it was before.

[Cosmosmom]

That has to be hard to get screamed and yelled at. I got yelled at some but it wasn't really that much and when I did, I knew I deserved it. My mom is really pretty reasonable long as you follow her rules (which are also generally pretty reasonable). Probably why I only moved out because I was getting married and my sister didn't move out until she was 29.
the big thing is I knew that she would say stop helping pay for college if I didn't get decent grades. Or when she said if you get a credit card, I'm done giving you money for school and other living expenses....I totally believed that she would pull the rug out from under me.
If mom threatened something, I absolutely believe she will follow through.

I'm sorry that you got cheated out of so much time with your mom.

and big with whatever dbf is pulling now.

[Suja]

You'll rue those words!!

I meant to put a sarcasm icon in there. I don't know if one or both of us will survive to her teenage-hood.

One of the most put together people I have ever met - she carried herself with such grace and dignity - it turned out, had a horrific past. She was removed from her home by CPS because she was being molested by an uncle, and her mom did nothing, although she knew. In the group home where she was placed, she was gang raped by some of the other kids. When I asked her how she got through it, she said that if she gave into her feelings of being a victim, then those *******s would've won, and she was not about to let that happen. She had control over how she responded to what happened to her, and the best revenge was to live a healthy, happy, productive life, while they rotted. I have a great deal of admiration for her; she was in her young 20s when we knew each other, and she was so very mature for her age.

[missychrissy]

I meant to put a sarcasm icon in there. I don't know if one or both of us will survive to her teenage-hood.

One of the most put together people I have ever met - she carried herself with such grace and dignity - it turned out, had a horrific past. She was removed from her home by CPS because she was being molested by an uncle, and her mom did nothing, although she knew. In the group home where she was placed, she was gang raped by some of the other kids. When I asked her how she got through it, she said that if she gave into her feelings of being a victim, then those *******s would've won, and she was not about to let that happen. She had control over how she responded to what happened to her, and the best revenge was to live a healthy, happy, productive life, while they rotted. I have a great deal of admiration for her; she was in her young 20s when we knew each other, and she was so very mature for her age.

That's exactly the sort of thing I hear or read about and wonder...how did they get there? I know for some women, it did take years. The whole thing just breaks my heart for her. She really had her sh!t together before that happened.

[daylilies]

I talk to a good deal of women on another site who have been abused in some way, and I think, you either pull through it and become an amazing person or you let it weigh you down and it affects you for the rest of your life. I think it affects you for the rest of your life, either way, but it can be negative or positive. It affects all your relationships forever and every time someone you meet has a trait that your abuser had or in any way reminds you (or "triggers" you) to think of your abuser it just can set you back to square one in recovery. From my observations it seems like a recovering alcoholic. You're never really "recovered". It's a day by day thing.

I was going to ask if she was in therapy. I'm glad she is. I'm sorry she's taking it out on you. I guess they never get over being able to push your buttons and knowing it's safe.

[Cosmosmom]

I talk to a good deal of women on another site who have been abused in some way, and I think, you either pull through it and become an amazing person or you let it weigh you down and it affects you for the rest of your life. I think it affects you for the rest of your life, either way, but it can be negative or positive. .

I have to say that I agree with this. Life can be great....but it can just be awful and hard sometimes. I don't know anyone who hasn't gone through something awful or tragic or super difficult. After taking some time to go through the emotions, it gets to a point where you have to decide if you are going to sink or swim. let go of what you cannot control and take charge of what you can.

I would look into reading something along these lines http://www.amazon.com/Resilience-Sci...rds=resilience

Or this looks good (though maybe better for those with younger kids) http://www.amazon.com/Building-Resil...rds=resilience


Kate, I was thinking of you last night when I was watching the view that I had DVR'd yesterday. They had NKOTB on announcing the new tour. Guys are still pretty cute...I liked Jordan and than Joey myself....but I thought that they looked so adult and old. And than I realized duh, I'm mid 30's myself so that makes sense. LOL Anyway looks like it will be a good concert!

[demigraf]

Right, Chrissy. I think it’s pretty fascinating the way some people pull through tragedies and come out the other side stronger and wiser, while others allow it to hold them back, maybe even allowing it to become their crutch of an excuse for personal shortcomings. Like Suja’s friend, for example, you just have to wonder, did she arrive that conclusion all by herself? Or was she lucky enough to have a positive person influence her and basically hand her that way of looking at her experience? The beauty of it, though, is that people can arrive at “empowered thinking” at any point in their lives, even after years of habitually looking at themselves as victims. Maybe it takes something else to happen, to help them realize their self-pity and victim role-playing isn’t working for them. So I have high hopes, Chrissy, that Bobbie will be able to let go the way she’s viewing herself at the moment. You are a strong role model for her, plus you’re still her mommy. I think if she sees you believe in her, she’ll absorb some of that confidence and make it her own. *hugs*

Bridget, I’m sorry M is driving you bananas. Feel free to share with us if it’ll make you feel better.

[missychrissy]

Right, Chrissy. I think it’s pretty fascinating the way some people pull through tragedies and come out the other side stronger and wiser, while others allow it to hold them back, maybe even allowing it to become their crutch of an excuse for personal shortcomings. Like Suja’s friend, for example, you just have to wonder, did she arrive that conclusion all by herself? Or was she lucky enough to have a positive person influence her and basically hand her that way of looking at her experience? The beauty of it, though, is that people can arrive at “empowered thinking” at any point in their lives, even after years of habitually looking at themselves as victims. Maybe it takes something else to happen, to help them realize their self-pity and victim role-playing isn’t working for them. So I have high hopes, Chrissy, that Bobbie will be able to let go the way she’s viewing herself at the moment. You are a strong role model for her, plus you’re still her mommy. I think if she sees you believe in her, she’ll absorb some of that confidence and make it her own. *hugs*

Bridget, I’m sorry M is driving you bananas. Feel free to share with us if it’ll make you feel better.

Yes, Bridget, please do. I cannot monopolize everyone's attention with my constant whining.

And I do have hopes that she'll eventually become a survivor. I would just like to know when. And finding the line between having empathy and patience, and not being a doormat, has become a bit blurry to me.

We've talked about the victim/survivor roles. Sometimes she's hopeful and optimistic herself. She's even been on the brink where she could actually see that for herself. Then other times she uses that as a weapon against me. Tells me I said that just because I don't want to hear about it any more (I've NEVER said that-this is her own perception), or that I don't get it and don't want to get it. I can't remember her exact words, but I know she's really wounded me because I've done nothing but try to be supportive and encouraging.

[daylilies]

I have to say that I agree with this. Life can be great....but it can just be awful and hard sometimes. I don't know anyone who hasn't gone through something awful or tragic or super difficult. After taking some time to go through the emotions, it gets to a point where you have to decide if you are going to sink or swim. let go of what you cannot control and take charge of what you can.

I would look into reading something along these lines http://www.amazon.com/Resilience-Sci...rds=resilience

Or this looks good (though maybe better for those with younger kids) http://www.amazon.com/Building-Resil...rds=resilience


Kate, I was thinking of you last night when I was watching the view that I had DVR'd yesterday. They had NKOTB on announcing the new tour. Guys are still pretty cute...I liked Jordan and than Joey myself....but I thought that they looked so adult and old. And than I realized duh, I'm mid 30's myself so that makes sense. LOL Anyway looks like it will be a good concert!

I watched that, of course! People are generally disgruntled that they're doing another joint tour. I'm trying to negotiate what kind of tickets we want with the girl I met on the cruise a couple years ago. VIP is too much but we're spoiled and we want at least close seats (even if they aren't the VIP package that come with the meet and greet-which is totally not worth the money anyway) I don't usually like Jordan but he did look great in black and red! And Joey of course, he's my fave. <3


Chrissy, I'm confident that with your support and her close friends' support she'll become a very strong woman in the end. It just might take a while.

[Gwenn]

Chrissy. She will get there in her own time. I know it's hard not knowing how long that will be.

Janet, welcome! Nice to see you in here.

[demigraf]

So... I have a juicy question for you guys... while you were with/since you've been with your S/O, did you ever have a crush on someone else? I want to hear your stories. I just learned the word, limerence (defined as a powerful and constantly distracting and obsessive infatuation), and firstly, I can't believe it took me 40 years to realize there was this label for it. LOL. And when I did learn it, and since I'm the analytical type, I made a list of all the men I've ever felt limerence for, and ran the numbers against a list of guys I actually had relations with to one extent or another and in what way. Those were some pretty fun statistics. There have been one or two men out there (usually married too) since I met DH that have given me a real good buzz from just being in close proximity. Not a one that I've ever wanted to throw it all away for, but some I've thought about, relived every conversation, and generally just felt really good to be around. I don't know if you'd precisely call it limerence with the ones I'm talking about, because limerence seems to be characterized by the pain of not having your feelings reciprocated, or a desperate need to know how the object of your limerence feels. While for me, limerence is not painful. It's pleasurable. I don't really ever want to know if that other person feels anything for me, am totally cool with not ever knowing. I just want to sort of enjoy the glow of someone else's delightful company and the prospect that he might feel that buzz too, safe in the knowledge that I have a great big substantial love waiting for me back at home (and he usually does too). Does that make any sense?