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Thread: Secular Confessions

  1. #42421
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    Nah, I think it's because we tend to be more educated and probably marry later in life. Not like we have to rush into marriage to get some action, kwim?

    Jennifer, 35, DH 36

  2. #42422

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    Bridget, I just have to say I am so glad you are not stuck in a rut anymore. I wanted to ask you, since I know you and M disagree on a lot of parenting things, how do you deal with that? Do you ever feel upset that you and M are not more of a united front and how do you handle it when your kids notice that you said yes and M said no, or vice versa? Do you ever feel like the kids know who to go to or how to ask for certain things because one of you usually says yes to that certain thing?

    Chrissy, I just saw the thing about the tantrum. I cringed because I can see Josh doing such a thing. I would have definitely said the computer was off limits for the rest of the day.

  3. #42423
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    Ok but on education....seems like if you are really educated, you aren't going to believe the bs literally. You can be religious and educated but I don't think you can be educated and believe that the world is only a few thousand years old.

    They mentioned UU's in there too as some of the most educated....I know by the two different ones I have gone to that a lot of the members tend to work in degreed positions...like here a lot of them are associated with the university.

    Crime...that one has me. Unless it's the whole men are the center of the universe attitude that leads them to feel like they can do more crimes. Plus if they tend to be less educated, that tends to lead to more crime?

    Jennifer, 35, DH 36

  4. #42424
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    It's simple. Poverty breeds crime. Educated people are better equipped at avoiding poverty.

    Mama to Bobbie 20 ~ Jesi 18 ~ Syd 14 ~ Conner 6
    I'm gonna be a Gramama! Jesi is due 11/22/13


  5. #42425

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    Agreed with Chrissy. Educated people have higher incomes, generally speaking. And I also agree with the bit about marrying later and being able to cohabit without censure. But regardless of the reasons, it's still nice to read. It's a real bee in my bonnet when religious types assume they corner the market on ethics and morals.

    Chrissy, I'm sorry about Conner. Poor guy. Those hours-long meltdowns are awful for everyone involved.
    -- mom to DD1 1/98 and DD2 10/09


  6. #42426
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    I am not surprised to see that Jehovah's Witness' are the least educated. The ones who converted my SIL and BIL discourage their members from further education, especially woman. That saddens me for my nieces/nephews

    Things are a little crazy, but I'm loving every minute of it My Blog


  7. #42427

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    Quote Originally Posted by pepperlru View Post
    Agreed with Chrissy. Educated people have higher incomes, generally speaking. And I also agree with the bit about marrying later and being able to cohabit without censure. But regardless of the reasons, it's still nice to read. It's a real bee in my bonnet when religious types assume they corner the market on ethics and morals.
    Like! Plus, I love anyone who uses the phrase "bee in my bonnet".

    So I'm on the hunt for a new job again. I know I say that a lot, but my boss had installed a manager between her and me, whom I really liked. She got rid of him now, and he's the reason I've been placated on the job recently. Without him, I'm having to take over a lot of his responsibilities and work closely with her again. Ugh. It had been a sweet couple of months.

    I sent out 11 resumes yesterday.

  8. #42428
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smplyme89 View Post
    I am not surprised to see that Jehovah's Witness' are the least educated. The ones who converted my SIL and BIL discourage their members from further education, especially woman. That saddens me for my nieces/nephews
    The fact that most forms of Christianity (that I'm aware of) teaches that the 'fruit of knowledge' is a sin should be a super duper red flag for anyone, imo. You know how literal those people can be.

    Quote Originally Posted by demigraf View Post
    Like! Plus, I love anyone who uses the phrase "bee in my bonnet".

    So I'm on the hunt for a new job again. I know I say that a lot, but my boss had installed a manager between her and me, whom I really liked. She got rid of him now, and he's the reason I've been placated on the job recently. Without him, I'm having to take over a lot of his responsibilities and work closely with her again. Ugh. It had been a sweet couple of months.

    I sent out 11 resumes yesterday.
    11 in 1 day? Good luck!

    Mama to Bobbie 20 ~ Jesi 18 ~ Syd 14 ~ Conner 6
    I'm gonna be a Gramama! Jesi is due 11/22/13


  9. #42429
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    Quote Originally Posted by missychrissy View Post
    The fact that most forms of Christianity (that I'm aware of) teaches that the 'fruit of knowledge' is a sin should be a super duper red flag for anyone, imo. You know how literal those people can be.
    Well, my SIL dropped out of highschool when she got pregnant at 15/16 (has stayed at home since), BIL graduated (I am pretty sure) but that is it. So, it doesn't surprise me they wouldn't think that education were all that important.

    Things are a little crazy, but I'm loving every minute of it My Blog


  10. #42430
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    Quote Originally Posted by missychrissy View Post
    The fact that most forms of Christianity (that I'm aware of) teaches that the 'fruit of knowledge' is a sin should be a super duper red flag for anyone, imo. You know how literal those people can be.


    !
    Well I think Catholics like education and the ones I know (most people I know in IRL are Catholic or Lutheran or nothing)...consider themselves Christian. I know the college I graduated from (which just two days ago became a university instead of a college!) is a women's Catholic university found by the school sisters of notre dame and the nuns big thing is education, especially for women and children and those in poverty. Some of my profs were nuns and taught such crazy things like evolution. ;)

    Jennifer, 35, DH 36

  11. #42431

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    Quote Originally Posted by missychrissy View Post
    11 in 1 day? Good luck!
    Yep. That's the market here. Actually, I recounted, and it was 14, plus another one this morning. I have my resume and cover letter pretty ironclad at this point so that they can generally apply to all positions, and I can shoot it out very quickly when I see a job I want to consider.

    We shall see...

  12. #42432
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    Quote Originally Posted by demigraf View Post
    Yep. That's the market here. Actually, I recounted, and it was 14, plus another one this morning. I have my resume and cover letter pretty ironclad at this point so that they can generally apply to all positions, and I can shoot it out very quickly when I see a job I want to consider.

    We shall see...
    wow. When I was really 'getting serious' about finding a job, I thought I was doing good to do 7-11 a week.

    Mama to Bobbie 20 ~ Jesi 18 ~ Syd 14 ~ Conner 6
    I'm gonna be a Gramama! Jesi is due 11/22/13


  13. #42433
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    Best of luck, Myles! Any company will be lucky to have such an awesome person as you working for them.

    I've only got two more weeks at my current job before summer vacation, and the kids are starting to make me feel sad with questions like, "Are you really leaving us, Miss?" "Can't you stay and do your training here, Miss?" and "I'm going to miss you, Miss!"

  14. #42434
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    Awww It sounds like they really love you!

    Mama to Bobbie 20 ~ Jesi 18 ~ Syd 14 ~ Conner 6
    I'm gonna be a Gramama! Jesi is due 11/22/13


  15. #42435
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    Good luck with your job hunt, Myles. My DH has been coming over to your workplace for some meetings lately and I keep forgetting to tell him to keep an eye out for you, and I think he has been so distracted that he probably wouldn't remember or even listen to me if I told him. He has been really stressed. He still has not been able to figure out if he's working on Friday or not, so I assume I'm still going out of town on my own with S.

    I sent my twins off with my mom to Wisconsin this morning for a little trip to see my grandma and some other relatives. I told them to stop by and see Bridget while they were there, so you guys should expect them in a day or two. S. cried the whole way back from the airport, through the massive traffic jam and then some, because he wasn't on the airplane too.

    Speaking of tantrums, what day hasn't been one long tantrum? They all just blend together. Even my kids have days like those, too. Usually it's my DH and S, lately, and then I get all cranky because they're all angry. The heat has not been helping matters. I've been trying to talk to him about what to do about behavior problems, and he says the last thing he wants to do in the evening after dealing with them all day is talk about them. He just wants to relax. Although today he agreed that if we approached it like a business meeting and set an agenda and a start and stop time he might be able to do it. I feel pressure to get more organized and have a project and plan or a Gantt chart or measurable criteria if we're going to approach it like that, though, and I feel like with a business meeting about kid behavior hanging over our heads, there is this inequality of power issue where he is granting me time and I am petitioning for it and I have to ensure that every second counts. What is he bringing to this meeting, besides time? Perhaps I'm reading too much into it.

    S. howled for a good 20 minutes last night because he wanted me to help him with his pajamas, and nobody else, and I was busy brushing someone's teeth at the time and told him I'd get to him in a minute and two other people tried to help him with his pajamas while he was waiting, and then when I did help him I was trying to help him to do it himself and he got upset and took off the pajamas he already had on and flung them on the floor so he could be sure that I would put them on from start to finish.

    My sister's husband also has not figured out if he's working on Friday or not. I guess I'm not alone.


  16. #42436

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    I agree L, that does sound a little too much like a business meeting, and that's kind of awkward and impersonal if that's not how both your minds work.

    I think I know where Josh gets his issues with listening. I had to tell DH twice today not to hover over me in the kitchen while I'm cooking or plating food. Actually, I've been telling him that every day for quite some time now. Is it weird that I just can't function when he does that? I made the lasagna wrong because both he and Josh were in the kitchen while I was putting it together. It came out fine, but didn't have a couple things I like to throw in there. Then I was trying to plate it which is a delicate procedure especially when it's more soupy than I wanted it to be. He's like, what can I do? I wanted to say "You can go away!" LOL
    Last edited by daylilies; 07-03-2013 at 04:18 PM.

  17. #42437

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    There is a huge imbalance in our house. I am partly to blame for calling out dbf in front of the kids which I know is NOTNOT cool so I am really trying. But sometimes he blatantly breaks house rules and I can't let that fly. He is so uninvolved and generally put out by parenting that I just don't think it is at all normal. The kids come to me for absolutely everything, even if I am in the back yard and he is sitting next to in the living room. I try to let him know about current behavior issues and how I am handling it but it is usually a waste of breath and/or an invite for him to criticize.

    I am still holding strong with the no rewards/punishment. Today we were looking at some overpriced yard fireworks and when e went on to leave without purchasing anything, Kai said, "I refuse to leave until you buy me something." first instinct was to say that would not get to join the festivities (because we do already have some and he knows that) but instead I said, "Will you leave if I throw you over my shoulder like a continental soldier?" To which he responded yes, a small smile. So I did and when we got to the car I looked him in the face and said, "It is never ok to demand that I buy something for you. Do you know that takes away the joy of buying fun things? Do you know there you sounded a bit like Harry Potter's cousin?"
    He said, with his head down, "Yes, mom. I know."
    I think it went well. The other way, he'd have stomped out and likely cried all the way home. And taking the festivities away would have hurt us all. Plus, I felt genuine remorse from him as opposed to doing what I asked in order to get what he wants.
    Last edited by Bridget; 07-03-2013 at 04:57 PM.

  18. #42438

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    Love the Harry Potter reference. We're in the middle of the second book I'd like to think that approach would work well with Josh but I'm not sure. I'll have to try it sometime.

  19. #42439
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    I'll talk about how you'd handle something that happened today. Mira is on a princess/Hello Kitty kick, and when I bought her toothbrush/paste (needed), I got those for her. When we got home, she asked for them, and I told her that she can help me unload the groceries, and in the process, find where they were. She took out the stuff that was in the bag (bread), threw/squished it, then squealed about how her toothbrush/paste were not in there.

    I told her what she did was not right, she couldn't get her stuff until the veggies were put away and she had calmed down, made sure she did it, and then, as I was handing her the toothbrush/paste, showed her the bread, asked her what had happened, and if she thought that was right. We had a discussion about what behavior is expected of princesses (which she wants to be, when she grows up), and although she started off saying that she wanted to be a spoiled princess, she ended up apologizing.

  20. #42440

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    Is Josh loving it? We listened to he audio books, then watched the movies, and now I am reading the first book to them. So they seem to like it just a bit!

    The part about the fireworks, and same goes for video games, is that it's something he knows dbf will be into, and likely do with him. So I feel the emotions around it are more intense.

  21. #42441
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    Oh, and out of curiosity, what would you have done if he had insisted and not cooperated with leaving?

  22. #42442

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    I think that sounds just fine, Suja. Was there a tantrum somewhere in that scenario? If so, the only thing I would say is that it doesn't seem necessary her to have to wait until everything is put away to get her things. That is pretty hard for a child that age to do. So I would avoid a tantrum rather than make her wait be there wasn't one?

  23. #42443

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    I don't know what I would have done. I am kind of winging this but determined not to resort to my old tactics.
    Last edited by Bridget; 07-03-2013 at 05:31 PM.

  24. #42444

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    Yeah, we finished the first book and watched the movie. He really liked it! I had never read the books before but DH and I went to all the movies. Josh started day camp a couple days after we finished the first book and when I picked him up after the first day, he had his face painted to look like Harry (giant glasses, and a lightning bolt on his forehead). I'm afraid it might get kind of complicated for him, but hopefully with all the books and movies out now, we can read and watch in pretty quick succession and he won't forget a lot of what's happened. I do love reading the voices since I've seen the movies and know what they sound like. I love reading Hagrid. LOL

  25. #42445

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    Sometimes if there's something he really wants I'll watch what bag it gets put into and then I'll ask him to put everything away that's in that bag and then he can have it.

  26. #42446

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    I love reading Hagrid too! I'm so glad you said that! lol

  27. #42447

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    I can't figure out how to say "summat" though. Ash? Is it really "summat"? I don't think I've ever heard someone use that.

  28. #42448
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    Oh yes. The tantrum started when she didn't find her stuff in the bread bag, became crying/wailing as she put the groceries away, and stopped once she got her stuff. If I ever say 'NO' to her, or chide her for something, she will tell me not to say that, it's not nice, and to apologize.

  29. #42449
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    L, I always feel so much empathy for what you're coping with-between the kids (stressful enough in the best of circumstances) and the dh. I wish I had some wise advice. It's difficult because he seems like one of those brilliant, scientific/math minded people that just won't comprehend if you say, "Do you have any idea how that makes me feel?" Not that he's insensitive-but that sort processes everything differently that 'we' do.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bridget View Post
    There is a huge imbalance in our house. I am partly to blame for calling out dbf in front of the kids which I know is NOTNOT cool so I am really trying. But sometimes he blatantly breaks house rules and I can't let that fly. He is so uninvolved and generally put out by parenting that I just don't think it is at all normal. The kids come to me for absolutely everything, even if I am in the back yard and he is sitting next to in the living room. I try to let him know about current behavior issues and how I am handling it but it is usually a waste of breath and/or an invite for him to criticize.

    I am still holding strong with the no rewards/punishment. Today we were looking at some overpriced yard fireworks and when e went on to leave without purchasing anything, Kai said, "I refuse to leave until you buy me something." first instinct was to say that would not get to join the festivities (because we do already have some and he knows that) but instead I said, "Will you leave if I throw you over my shoulder like a continental soldier?" To which he responded yes, a small smile. So I did and when we got to the car I looked him in the face and said, "It is never ok to demand that I buy something for you. Do you know that takes away the joy of buying fun things? Do you know there you sounded a bit like Harry Potter's cousin?"
    He said, with his head down, "Yes, mom. I know."
    I think it went well. The other way, he'd have stomped out and likely cried all the way home. And taking the festivities away would have hurt us all. Plus, I felt genuine remorse from him as opposed to doing what I asked in order to get what he wants.
    That's really awesome Bridget. I've found that often we get so caught up in achieving all our goals and many struggles boil down to "you will do X because I said to!" when in reality, if we can all think quick on our feet and turn it into a fun situation (like you did) it's much easier (and fun!) for everyone. I do not believe that kids need a strict black/white, you must obey me because I'm the parent in order for them to learn how to cope with the world.

    Mama to Bobbie 20 ~ Jesi 18 ~ Syd 14 ~ Conner 6
    I'm gonna be a Gramama! Jesi is due 11/22/13


  30. #42450

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    That's the problem, I can't think quick on my feet and it often takes me walking away for a few minutes (sometimes after I've said something dumb like "if you don't do x you can't do y) and coming back and trying to fix it. I don't know if that's a great way to parent, making a mistake the first time and having to go back and fix it.

    Like tonight, we went to see fireworks and I brought a snack for Josh, and he didn't finish it because he thought we would be there longer and he'd have time to have more. We left early because it was so foggy we couldn't see the fireworks. On the way home he threw an absolute fit (and we were walking about 2 miles home because it was a lot faster than driving back through all the traffic). It was 10:00 and I really didn't feel right giving him a snack at that hour. It turned into a complete meltdown that finally diffused when I apologized for it not going the way he thought it would. But should I have given him a snack just to make him feel better, even if it meant staying up even later when he was obviously tired? I'm pretty convinced the whole meltdown was mostly because he was tired. I think I should have given him a snack, in hindsight. Sigh.

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