She said that he "may need it". I responded that I really hoped they could find someone soon. Dbf was like, "You didn't have thoughts like that?" I said No! I even if I did, it's not normal or ok in any way shape or form for a child to feel this way.
Senior Geek
Hopelessly Devoted
It's really not Bridget. You're right. Good gracious. That blase attitude is troubling.
Mama to Bobbie 20 ~ Jesi 18 ~ Syd 14 ~ Conner 6
I'm gonna be a Gramama!
Senior Geek
Hopelessly Devoted
omg-Bobbie just called me. They have to discharge her today because our insurance is refusing to pay beyond today. I'm livid.
Mama to Bobbie 20 ~ Jesi 18 ~ Syd 14 ~ Conner 6
Wow that is shocking your DBF is so blase about that! It would frighten me if any of my nephews felt like taking their life. All of my nephews, like most kids, are just great kids and wonderful young men. The oldest is 14 and I can't imagine not taking some action if he admitted to me thoughts of suicide. I honestly would like to bring the oldest to live with me. I so feel that his mom and my brother don't deserve the great kids they have. I feel bad thinking that, but it is the truth and I don't think they realize what wonderful boys they have and how they should be grateful. I am always grateful for Ky and I have already talked to him about suicidal thoughts and how if he ever feels that way to let me know. I would quit my job and stay home with him and make a priority of him over anything. I hope he takes what I say seriously as you never know with pre-teens/teenagers what goes on in their minds.
I feel much better today in regards to my breathing. I was taking the pill at night and so when I woke up yesterday with those issues, it was really weird. I forgot to mention, I got in a car accident at the grocery store yesterday too, after I dropped of my co-worker. I was backing up and then I saw what looked like another car backing up and we grazed each other. Unfortunately I was at what I call the "Ghetto Kroger" and the lady was pretty ghetto and I provided my insurance information to her and asked for hers and she wouldn't give it to me, saying she shouldn't have to because it was my fault. Honestly, I don't care about taking fault for a slight accident like that, my van is still not fixed from the theft and I have the money to fix it and the little bit of damage that was caused by this accident (a little dent in the bumper but I have already set up having my whole bumper replaced due to the theft damage on the bumper). But I know you usually swap info and her not wanting to give me her info made me think she didn't have license or insurance or something, plus since she was ghetto acting I figured that she may try to inflate her claim about what happened. I have been around long enough to know that these sorts of accidents usually are "no fault" anyway and each of our insurance companies will pay for the other's damage. I guess she didn't want hers to pay for mine or something and really I don't care about that since that is what insurance is for and I didn't feel like dealing with ghetto lunatics and like I said, I have the money to pay for mine. To be an ass I went ahead and filed a claim on her insurance since when she finally provided it to me it said it was expired. I was having problems breathing at the time and had to wait in the high 90 degree weather with 90 percent humidity which made it worse by the time I finally got home as the police didn't come for an hour. So I figured I punish her for being a hood rat and talking all crazy, seeming to try to edge me on to being ghetto too lol! She was like "YOU DID THIS, I AIN'T DO THIS, WHY I GOT TO GIVE YOU MY INSURANCE." Over and over again, it was like dealing with a little kid. Then she threatened "I'm going to call the police!" Like I am afraid of the police or something. I told her to call them and she didn't so I said "I thought you were calling the police. Since you aren't, I'll call them and we can wait." Then she got all nervous. The police did end up giving her a citation for expired license. So that is what she gets.
She had some other damage on her car in the front and I figured the police would make a report about how she and her "play brother" weren't hurt since I know people in that neighborhood like to sue and she might all the sudden claim all sorts of back injuries or something.
Erin
That is great that Bobbie got the job. Not so good that they are releasing her....though in reality I think that very few insurances cover that beyond a few days tops.
I actually kind of think that DBF was correct and I think that many young teens have it at least cross their mind. I wasn't depressed but hated junior high and have to admit that it did cross my mind. Never seriously but more a what if. And I know that it absolutely crossed DH's mind....and in a more serious way than me but he never was serious enough to try anything.
BUT if I did have a person admit to me that they were thinking about it...OMG, we would be in therapy so fast.
Erin that lady does sound crazy! I think that I would have been scared!
I'm just like you in the asthma department....same use with the inhaler...I carry it but use a few times a year and usually a cold, weather and sometimes exercise are triggers. Used to be much worse when I was younger.
And I have trouble with water retention. In the morning my ankles are all slim....sometimes by the time I get home from work they are definitely swollen. I have been trying to remember to get up at work instead of sitting for hours. I also stopped buying ham for my lunch and have turkey instead....that has helped a lot. I put my feet up for a while at night watching TV. Heat and humidity are big triggers....I will leave for work and my watch will be slipping around my wrist....I get to work and it's tight. And this is all of 10 minutes later.
I will not take a water pill though. I figure that if I'm otherwise pretty healthy and I am not retaining when I wake up the morning, I just let it go and work on drinking more water and consuming less salt where I can.
Jennifer, 34, DH 36
Every day is a gift. It's just... does it have to be a pair of socks?
Hopelessly Devoted
I attempted suicide a few times in my teens. I think it's not uncommon. It doesn't mean it's not serious, and I'm really glad I wasn't successful, but I do think it's not unusual to have thoughts about it, and even make attempts.
I have been working really late hours lately, and have had no time to post, but I have been checking in on you all. Last night I was woken up so many times (nightmare! bloody nose! miscellaneous crying! falling out of bed! dh's phone buzzing for emails from Germany at 4 am!) and for so many reasons and then ended up with a migraine and a stomach ache and got pretty much no sleep, so I feel awful today. After this I have a couple days off so I should be able to recover and post again. I am thinking good thoughts for all of you and your families.
Our baby is 3 years old already!
Jen I am rarely afraid of ghetto acting people! They like it when you get scared and it eggs them on to try to intimidate you. I was very calm and collected. Oddly enough, that usually scares them. She looked scared of me. I have come across way too many crazy acting people in my life (of all varieties) to be afraid of someone talking to me in a ghetto/trashy sort of way. I am not one of those people who like to fight or go all nutso with words either. The only time I can think of being afraid of people are the crazy aggressive panhandlers here as a lot of them are mentally ill and not under the care of a professional. Most ghetto/trashy acting women are nothing more than people who have nothing going on in their lives so they try to build up their reputation via small incidences like this accident as being "tough." A lot of time they try to make themselves out to be a victim too so you can feel sorry for them and other ghetto/trashy people will tell them what they "shoulda done" and so on. I don't have time for all that and I'm not going to buy into their puffed up persona of them being somebody I should fear when they aren't.
In regards to you swollen ankles, I know you are working out more. Do you do any weight training? That can really take away the puffy ankles as they can lead to high blood pressure or circulation issues, especially varicose veins, which I don't want to get. I haven't been doing my weight lifting because I felt I was doing too much so I started back this week and am working my way up. Even just a few toning exercises without weights will help with the swelling for me.
Erin
Just saw this Chrissy. Is she going to come and stay with you? That is too bad they won't pay for any additional days. Can you call them and appeal? I know our insurance will give some leeway if the doctor requests it for hospital stays (including mental health) or prescription requests.Originally Posted by missychrissy
So glad she got the job. How is she today? I hope feeling in better spirits.
Erin
Oh, man, sorry to hear you were in an accident, Erin. That sounds like it should be a movie scene-the girl being ghetto and you just being like, 'whatever, dude.'
I thought about suicide a few times when I was younger when life was pretty miserable but never did anything about it; just thought about what it would be like to die and how I could do it. Bridget, I hope your nephew gets some help; it's scary in this day and age when it does seem like an epidemic of teenagers taking their own lives.
I know I don't have high BP yet but it's not low either. But I have noticed some varicose veins on the upper outter thighs that I'm not happy about. My dad has those also and I take strongly after his side of the family physically.
Not doing weight training but it has come down in terms of severity just from stopping the ham at lunch as well as losing the weight i have so far. I haven't been exercising that much extra yet...some weeks I do more and others not as much. This week I have been trying to get the dogs out for a walk and have done that about every other day. Usually I just take them out back and watch from the deck. I have also been getting on the floor and doing stretches to work on increasing flexibility again and I think that helps.
This sitting at a computer pretty much all day is NOT helpful.
Jennifer, 34, DH 36
The sodium is probably lower with the turkey of course. I try to steer away from ham even though I actually really like ham. You can also try eating more potassium rich foods as they aid in flushing sodium from the system. Dandelion root tea is a natural remedy as well if you like herbal teas. It is what I was using before trying to be "good" and taking the pills. You can get dandelion root in a pill form but you shouldn't take it if you are prone to spring allergies or hay fever.
Erin
Oh yeah the ham was way saltier! Bummer as I liked it better than the turkey. Didn't realize about the potassium but i have also been eating more of that since getting on this whole change in diet and exercise thing. I have definitely seen improvement from the combo of the change in diet and exercise.
Jennifer, 34, DH 36
http://vitals.nbcnews.com/_news/2012...-suggests?lite
This was interesting and something I could relate to. I did minimal treatments before realizing it was just too much for me.
Jennifer, 34, DH 36
Lol Erin, I really love how you told that story about the ghetto woman. I can almost hear her!
I've been thinking all day about what y'all say about lots of kids thinking about suicide. I remember talking to my friend about how we'd go sit in the woods in the middle of winter since we had read that hypothermia invokes a totally peaceful, warm feeling. I guess for me, when a child tells his mama he's had these thoughts, he's screaming for help.
I can't stop thinking about him. I really love him and I see a lot of physical similarities between him and Savana. Their body type, the way they carry themselves, even the way they tell a story. I emailed dbf's mom to see if he'd like to come and stay with us for a bit before school starts. He really enjoys being with Savana and Kai and we haven't seen him for so long. I'm waiting for her to get back to me. I'd have asked his sister directly but I'm not sure she knows we know, or if she'd want us to know. Her and her husband are on the verge of a split so I can imagine she is just a wreck.
Every day is a gift. It's just... does it have to be a pair of socks?
Hopelessly Devoted
Do you guys remember the article Spoiled Rotten? I've just been perusing a couple of articles written in rebuttal to it, and feeling a lot better about the whole thing.
Obedience: Why do you have to tell them five times?
10 ways to raise a competent, confident child
Bridget, I think that's a very good idea to invite him.
Erin, I hope you're feeling better now, and what a day you must have had!
Katycat, how are you doing? Any better?
I got word that S. was just accepted to preschool for a MWF position. This is a lot earlier than the twins started, and I applied on the spur of the moment, but I think he'll be lonely with the twins in school. I think he's socially mature enough to adapt well.
Last edited by 3andMe; 08-08-2012 at 11:16 PM.
Our baby is 3 years old already!
L, those articles were excellent. And I imagine S will do very well in preschool! I hope he enjoys it!
Me (38) DH (45) & furbabies * m/c 7/08 4/12 11/12
I'm sure S will do great in preschool. And everyone will think he's a three year old.
Those were great articles. I wonder if I could get dbf to read them. We've been struggling with Kai lately.
Omg, dbf's mom is a trip. She is saying that they'd send him to visit us exept the stress of three or four stops/layovers would be too much for him. So I say that we would be more than happy to share in the cost of getting him a direct flight to which she responded that to get to wisconsin it as a minimum of 3 stops and there is simply no way to get a direct flight. Lol! She's a trip. This far off land of wisconsin is so hard to get to. If only we lived in Hawaii, right?
Of course, Bridget! If only you lived on a small island in the middle of a vast ocean! It would be SO much easier to get to you.
Do you know where this boy lives? I'd be SO tempted to send her specific flight information thta did not involve 3 stops.
Every day is a gift. It's just... does it have to be a pair of socks?
Hopelessly Devoted
Maybe she's trying to look at flying to and from the smaller towns near the larger metro areas, thus adding little puddle-jumper flights? She always has to get that dig in, right?
They probably would, except that I've been taking him there to pick up and drop off the twins since he was two months old, so even some of the other moms who are starting their kids in school now know how old he is because they were there at the same time picking up their older kids and we had little babies at the same time. S. has been greeting the teachers by name and now just runs in, arranges the magnet letters to spell his name, goes over to the toy store and plays with the food, and then runs out to the back and plays in the garden and the playground when we get there. I usually have to drag him out of there.
There was another S. there by the same name who is graduating, so it will be nice to not have to be known as S_____ Last Initial. I had not predicted that, especially in such a small school.
Our baby is 3 years old already!
Um they cannot fly into Milwaukee????? Is it to far for you all to get to OHare? I have always been able to get in and out of Milwaukee except when I went to France we did fly from OHare.
Jennifer, 34, DH 36
L - I actually have never understood why people, as parents, seem so keen on "obedience". After all, isn't the job of parenting to turn a child into an adult? And unquestioning obedience is not a particularly useful skill for an adult. Critical thinking, now, that's something worth pushing! I want to raise a confident child who can figure out for herself when to go along with what she's told and when to do something different.
D-Mama (37) D-Dada (43) and D-Baby (11/02/2011)
Because some things are non-negotiable. And until some ages, children do not have the mental ability to make logical, reasoned choices. While we should instill critical thinking skills, your average 2 or 3 year old isn't going to be capable of it, and some things do end up coming down to 'Because I said so' (since the explain till you're blue in the face approach often fails).
We've pretty much only got disobedience going on these days, and I can tell you that it is utterly draining.
Suja, I totally get that. I was really addressing the concepts in the spoiled rotten article L posted which seems more about older kids, and was also trying to be brief and not go off on all kinds of tangents. So, yes, babies and toddlers need to be obedient to some extent (and even then, I'm not sure that at the age when it's most necessary, kids have the impulse control to BE obedient). It just seems to me that for many people around me, training obedience is the entire goal of parenting. So much of traditional parenting seems about control and the idea that if your kids don't hop to the moment you speak, you're doing something wrong, or that's a problem that needs to be corrected. A kid trying to make a reasonable argument is often suppressed, and sometimes even punished for "back-talking" and it just seems...counterproductive, somehow?
But what do I know? I have a 9 month old. Maybe I'll be changing my tune in 5 years.
D-Mama (37) D-Dada (43) and D-Baby (11/02/2011)
I tend a lot more to the traditional side than most in here but I think obedience is pretty important for kids and as an adult. I mean just because we are adults doesn't mean we can do whatever we want....there are laws to follow, bosses to listen to, spouses to contend with.
Critical thinking is also important...but that is a hard skill to develop and not something that comes along until older.
I like a balance....which was how I was raised. My mom was pretty strict and definitely boss. But long as we talked nicely (not snotty or tantrum like), we were allowed to ask questions and present our side of things. The house was not a democracy though! The older I got, the more I got to make decisions.
Jennifer, 34, DH 36
I never really think so much about obedience per se but I do see disciplining as necessary in our family and our discipline in a way does depend on obedience to certain rules. So in that respect, I think teaching children obedience teaches them to follow the rules, which in turn can keep them safe and out of trouble with the law or other societal dangers. It also teaches them to think about the rules, whether something is right or wrong, encouraging critical thinking.
For our family, we do have specific rules and we have a pretty strict morning schedule (and a looser evening schedule). Both my kids have certain things to do that I won't do for them and they need to be done at a certain time or there will be consequences (being late to school for Ky which he hates as he is penalized at school for tardiness is an example, a few times Elle has done things to make us late. And Ky will be very upset about it and I do think that she realizes that we have to follow the rules and not think of only ourselves all the time by putt-putting around. She doesn't like for Ky to be upset and so will rarely do anything off schedule after the few times last year where her dawdling made us late). For back talking, I also don't allow it and it is one of our rules. This mostly covers things that are supposed to be done, like chores and homework. I don't want to hear any backtalk about it since they have to get done and regardless of whether they have an excuse or reason, it has to be done. Ky knows this and so doesn't backtalk me about these things. I disagree with the theme of the other article that discussed obedience due to my thoughts on this. I don't argue with children and maybe that makes me some huge child oppressor (lol, I'm kidding in case people don't understand this is a joke!). But I see it as counterproductive to argue with children, especially younger kids, they are pretty irrational (Ky is 10 and he can be pretty irrational too BTW). I will and have let my kids say their piece but most of the time but I'm not going to have a long drawn out discussion on "tie your shoes" or "take a bath." Unless the child is paralyzed and can't move their arms/fingers or unless they are clean already, there is no reason to have any back talk in our house about these things. That said, we have set bath times/days (Elle doesn't take a bath everyday) so I am never interrupting them doing something else for bathtime and I cannot imagine many scenarios (that aren't outlandish) where a kid has a valid reason for not untying their own shoes.
I did read the spoiled rotten article. I do think in a way we are "spoiling" children in our country compared to other countries, even "first world" countries like what is mentioned in the article about the way an American mother in France's child (raised American) differed from the French children. We don't expect a lot of our children IMO. I just think the expectations are getting lower and lower, but that may be the old fogey in me speaking. The article did mention how French mothers "ignore" their children and let them work things out. There was a thread recently in NM&MIG where some of the ladies here said they had to entertain their children all day and I think that is an American thing. I guess I am more French because I do ignore kids a lot. I expect them to play with each other and learn how to do things and experience certain situations, basically I think ignoring them and not always leading the way will teach them to think critical thoughts, which will lead to wise actions (hopefully). I think most parents want the best for their kids though and many parents feel that they want to give their kids "the things they never had." When a lot of times the stuff they had (not a lot of material things, good boundaries, time to play and be kids) was good enough and doesn't necessarily need improvement.
Erin
I'm not a fan of the word obedience because it makes me think of dogs instead of children. I think it's important to set limits and I also will not argue with my children but I am happy to explain to them why we do things the way we do. Really there is a reason for everything and I very rarely find it necessary to say, "because I said so". My mom said that to me all the time and I really hated it. I think my annoyance over her saying that to me all the time totally clouded whatever lesson she was trying to teach me. Everything I just said applies to when they are older, obviously. When they are wee ones, they can't understand reason anyway so it's a waste of breath. But I do usually find that with very young children, most undesirable behavior is just an unmet need. So I try to provide them with whatever it is they seem to be needing.
Chrissy, you around? How's Bobbie today?
Wanted to mention I also don't even like the label "traditional." What really constitutes that? When I came to APA I remember all the Trad vs AP stuff and honestly a lot of the AP stuff is more "traditional" in nature, like BFing and co-sleeping and such, people have done this stuff forever!
The only difference is all the "child centered" references that people made in those arguments in regards to AP IMO. I am not a big child led proponent, since like I said I think children are oftentimes irratonal. They are not mature enough to know what to do all the time. They over-react a lot. I feel like they need some space in order to work things out (hence the ignoring) and learn to self-discipline. I also don't think that the children are the most important part of a family. Each family member is important so I am more of a "family centered" person.
I think most of the parenting style books and media outlets are just out to divide people based on ideologies and make people think they are better than another because they are more "gentle" or "stern" or whatever. I try not to pay attention to any of that.
Erin
I can definitely think of ways in which obedience is overrated. Don't get me wrong. I see the importance of obedience as a complement to all kinds of things like trust, self-discipline, cooperation and perseverance (or the ability to "obey" oneself). But to Dana's point, yes, the emphasis on obedience is often wrongly fueled by the desire to demonstrate one's ability to control, instead of the desire to instruct. The unfortunate kids end up with parents who are quasi-dictators that get a sad little ego-stroke out of the fact that they got a child to do their bidding.
I do think we need to help our children understand why they're supposed to obey. Our kids start off as these totally helpless creatures and frankly, we DO spoil our tiny infants rotten, in the sense that we respond immediately to their cries with cuddles, boobs, food, clean diapers, rocking, shushing, etc. As they age, we basically go from waiting on them hand and foot, to suddenly being the boss whose every word they need to heed, constantly "NO, NO, NO-ing" them to death and often being the one person that stands in the way of them doing what they want to do. It's a tough transition for them, maybe even a breach of trust in their eyes. That's why I always do try to explain to B why he needs to listen. I talk (sometimes til I'm blue) about what the consequences are if he doesn't do as I say. That's my emphasis, anyway. And as far as 3 year olds go, he strikes me as a surprisingly rational human being already.
He does like to use the word, "otherwise..." if that's any indication.
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