Secular Confessions

[MashedUp]

Mandy, I'm sorry about your kitty

[MashedUp]

I'm so sorry, Mandy. Will kitty be able to recover at all?

Myles and Lisa, I'm sorry y'all have such stressful jobs. Y'all do well to do such work and still have the energy to keep up with your young'ns!

Thanks. I feel like I'm a zombie half the time, but most days my work isn't too bad. They pay me really well and the benefits are great.

[demigraf]

Mandy, . I'm sorry about your kitty.

Suja, I'm glad for the feedback on CM. I confess we do very little training of dogs at all anymore, since they mostly lie around all day and we're so focused on Bodhi these days. But there are some bad habits we'd still like to address with them, so I'll take a look at what you shared. Thanks!

[Gwenn]

The treatment plan the vet is recommending costs more than we have available to pay out of pocket so the recommended tx is out of the question. For now she is in an oxygen cage at the vet hospital for a few hours to see how she responds, and the vet will do a LASIK injection (she would prefer IV). We'll take it from there, but this will almost certainly become a recurring issue.

[Gwenn]

DH and I always thought CM was rather rough with the dogs, too, although I can't claim the knowledge Suja has in that area.

[demigraf]

Goodness, Suja, that's a long list of CM critiques:

READ MORE ABOUT CESAR MILLAN:
NEW! - American Veterinary Society of Animal Behavior - Letter to Merial
American Humane Association - "Dog Whisperer Training Approach More Harmful Than Helpful"
New York Times/Mark Derr - "Pack of Lies"
Esquire Magazine/Curtis Pesmen - "Misguided Expert of the Year"
Andrew Luescher, DVM, Veterinary Behaviorist, Animal Behavior Clinic, Purdue University
Paul Owens, the Original Dog Whisperer - "A Bone To Pick?"
Michael Linder - "Dog Owners Want To Bury Cesar?"
USA TODAY - "Dog Whisperer" Cesar Millan Sued by TV Producer
Newsday - "A 'Tough Love' Dog Whisperer Spurs Some Yelps"
DailyPress.com/Steve Dale - "Dog Whisperer Makes a Lousy Role-Model For Dog Owners"
The Anti-Cesar Millan -- Ian Dunbar's been succeeding for 25 years with lure-reward dog training; how come he's been usurped by the flashy, aggressive TV host?
IAABC Concerns Regarding Child Safety on National Geographic's Dog Whisperer Show
From the BLOG of RICHARD BELZER: "FIRST DO NO HARM"

Maybe I didn't know as much about him as I thought. I always thought of him as a gentle trainer (we never used physical punishment), but then again, I just watched his edited show. I'm definitely interested in reading these links.

[3andMe]

Mandy, I'm so sorry. The lasix (I think that's probably what the vet wants to give) is a diuretic, and will help relieve some of the fluid and help your kitty's heart not have to work so hard and clear the lungs up at the same time. It is a very common medicine given with heart failure, in humans as well.

[Gwenn]

I thought that was what I typed. Darn autocorrect.

If she pulls through from the lasix, will she be okay for the short or medium term? I don't suppose anyone knows but if she's just going to be sick from here on out I don't know how hard it's worth fighting to save her. Hate to say that. She is a fighter, though. I don't think she would have made it through last night when she started getting sick if she weren't.

[girlwonder]

My kitty is on lasix right now for her hypertension- it worked pretty well on lowering her blood pressure until recently and we have had to up the dosage again. We pay about $30/month for our prescription - we get it compounded in fish solution so my cats loves to get her medicine every day. Good luck.

[Bridget]

So sorry, Mandy!

[3andMe]

So Mandy, it would probably be best to talk to your vet and figure out your kitty's prognosis. It really depends on what caused the heart failure (it can be caused by different things, and some of those things could be correctable to some degree or another, or it might just be unknown) and if it's a slow, progressive type or an acute type. I would guess that she will not recover completely, and it will be a question of whether she can be stabilized and be okay on medications for a while or if despite medications she will continue to get worse. Probably getting to the bottom of this (causes, determination of acute vs chronic, etc) will require some blood tests and some heart tests, chest x-rays, etc. and I'm sure she has already had some done. Kitties are much better than people at not showing symptoms of heart failure until it's advanced, so it's harder to catch early and treat.

I would be totally up front with your vet and ask what the situation is regarding prognosis, additional tests, and quality of life. I have had to make similar decisions more than once (as a pet owner, let me be specific and NOT as a nurse), and it is very difficult, but I think it's very hard to let a dying kitty know that the tests or medicine or shots she is getting are for her own good, and that they are just happening in order to prolong her uncomfortable life. There is a point where the joy in life is completely outbalanced by the pain or suffering, and it seems like when there is no understanding of the need for the suffering, it's easier to tip that balance toward ending the suffering.

[Bridget]

So Mandy, it would probably be best to talk to your vet and figure out your kitty's prognosis. It really depends on what caused the heart failure (it can be caused by different things, and some of those things could be correctable to some degree or another, or it might just be unknown) and if it's a slow, progressive type or an acute type. I would guess that she will not recover completely, and it will be a question of whether she can be stabilized and be okay on medications for a while or if despite medications she will continue to get worse. Probably getting to the bottom of this (causes, determination of acute vs chronic, etc) will require some blood tests and some heart tests, chest x-rays, etc. and I'm sure she has already had some done. Kitties are much better than people at not showing symptoms of heart failure until it's advanced, so it's harder to catch early and treat.

I would be totally up front with your vet and ask what the situation is regarding prognosis, additional tests, and quality of life. I have had to make similar decisions more than once (as a pet owner, let me be specific and NOT as a nurse), and it is very difficult, but I think it's very hard to let a dying kitty know that the tests or medicine or shots she is getting are for her own good, and that they are just happening in order to prolong her uncomfortable life. There is a point where the joy in life is completely outbalanced by the pain or suffering, and it seems like when there is no understanding of the need for the suffering, it's easier to tip that balance toward ending the suffering.

Agreed

[Cosmosmom]

The Anti-Cesar Millan -- Ian Dunbar's been succeeding for 25 years with lure-reward dog training; how come he's been usurped by the flashy, aggressive TV host?


Ian Dunbar is who the trainers follow at the dog school we went to. He basically has his whole text here http://www.dogstardaily.com/training...ining-textbook

The ones we have used have really worked out well....and really anything bad Molly is doing now is our fault for not practicing enough. Like walking on a leash....but we have started working on that a little more. Jumping up at us we are still working on. But she sits really well and will pretty often come when called and is good now in her kennel.

I do agree with CM in that it helps the dog be calm when we are calm. If I'm stressed or worried....my dogs have always picked up on that.
I don't like his ideas on not treating dogs like our babies. Because well I do treat Cosmo like she is my baby. Molly hasn't earned that totally yet but is getting there.

[Gwenn]

Thanks. I agree. As of this morning when we took her in, that joy was gone. Poor baby mewed for us in the middle of the night just to let us know she didn't want to be alone. Didn't want to cuddle but sat where she could see us. But she seemed so weak and couldn't really even mew properly.

The vet did an x-ray today and would recommend the cardiologist for further testing. I have my suspicions the steroid shot she received on Monday for her skin condition is at the root of this - they have been warning us it can lead to organ failure. But nothing else treats the skin condition and when she is sick with that, she refuses food and drink. I'm sure it was the steroid.

DH is very against putting animals down but even he is considering it here. Breaks my heart especially to see him cry. We've had that cat almost since we started dating and she has been the strongest of all of us, DH and myself included.

[missychrissy]

this is so sad. I wish I could do something to ease your pain. I'm thinking of you guys. I know how much it hurts to be in that spot Mandy.

[Cosmosmom]

Oh Mandy

[3andMe]

I'm so sorry, Mandy.

[AbbeysMom]

Thanks. I agree. As of this morning when we took her in, that joy was gone. Poor baby mewed for us in the middle of the night just to let us know she didn't want to be alone. Didn't want to cuddle but sat where she could see us. But she seemed so weak and couldn't really even mew properly.

The vet did an x-ray today and would recommend the cardiologist for further testing. I have my suspicions the steroid shot she received on Monday for her skin condition is at the root of this - they have been warning us it can lead to organ failure. But nothing else treats the skin condition and when she is sick with that, she refuses food and drink. I'm sure it was the steroid.

DH is very against putting animals down but even he is considering it here. Breaks my heart especially to see him cry. We've had that cat almost since we started dating and she has been the strongest of all of us, DH and myself included.

I'm so sorry.

[Bridget]

[Gwenn]

Well, the vet called to say that not only was Cosi not responding to the lasix, she was actually getting worse. She said she could give her another shot, but she honestly didn't feel it would help and she suggested we consider having her put down. So it's done. From the time we brought her into the office, they took her in back and I didn't get to see her.

[Cosmosmom]

Oh Mandy I'm so sorry.

[Bridget]

Oh, Mandy. Big huge hugs. I'm sorry you lost your furry friend.

[missychrissy]

Oh Mandy I'm so very sorry sweetie.

[daylilies]

Nooo I'm so sorry.

[Suja]

I'm so sorry, Mandy. That has to be so hard.

[Inca]

So sorry about your kitty.

[girlwonder]

I'm so sorry for your loss and I'm sorry you didn't get to see her.

[AmeriBrit]

I'm so sorry, Mandy. (hugs)

[demigraf]

Well, the vet called to say that not only was Cosi not responding to the lasix, she was actually getting worse. She said she could give her another shot, but she honestly didn't feel it would help and she suggested we consider having her put down. So it's done. From the time we brought her into the office, they took her in back and I didn't get to see her.

I am so sad for you, honey. I can only imagine your pain today.

[3andMe]

I am so sorry for you and your dh, Mandy. And for Cosi.